Jun 18, 2025 Bond Committee Meeting

[CALL TO ORDER]

[00:00:07]

CALL THIS MEETING TO ORDER. IT IS 630. AND THIS IS A MEETING OF THE 2025 BOND COMMITTEE.

WEDNESDAY, JUNE 18TH, 2025. CALL THIS MEETING TO ORDER. ARE THERE ANY PUBLIC COMMENTS THAT SOMEONE

[A. Consider the minutes for the June 2, 2025, Bond Committee meeting;]

MOVE TO APPROVE. MR. GORDON, IS THERE A SECOND? SECOND. VIA. ALL IN FAVOR, SAY AYE. AYE. OPPOSED?

[B. Review draft report and discuss recommendation to Council.]

AND I KNOW, ERIC, YOU HAD ASKED ME SPECIFICALLY ABOUT FINANCIAL FINANCIAL IMPACTS. SO I WANTED TO START WITH THAT. TALK ABOUT SOME OF THAT. TALK ABOUT PROJECTS AGAIN, TALK ABOUT SOME STRATEGIES. JUST HIGH LEVEL. AND I'M GOING TO TRY TO BE BRIEF SO THAT YOU GUYS HAVE TIME TO DISCUSS AND REALLY KIND OF GO THROUGH SOME OF THIS, SOME OF THIS STUFF. SO LET ME JUST JUMP UP HERE. SO OBVIOUSLY YOU'VE SEEN THIS SLIDE BEFORE. WE'VE HAD IT ON EVERYTHING IN TERMS OF THE TIMELINE. SO I KNOW YOU GUYS DON'T HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ON THAT. SO I'M JUST GOING TO SKIP OVER THAT. THE PURPOSE OF THE COMMITTEE TO CHARGE THE FIVE QUESTIONS I MORE PUT THEM UP HERE FOR REFERENCE IN CASE WE NEED TO COME BACK TO THEM THROUGHOUT THE EVENING. SO LET ME JUMP RIGHT INTO PROJECTS. I SHOWED THIS TO YOU LAST AT THE LAST MEETING. WE TALKED ABOUT KIND OF LOW COST, HIGH COST RANGE OF THESE VARIOUS PROJECTS, LOW END, 44 MILLION TIE IN 68 MILLION. LET'S JUST BE HONEST, IT'S NOT REALISTIC THAT ALL THESE ARE GOING TO GET FUNDED.

AND JUST BE CLEAR. I MEAN IT'S AND I DON'T THINK THAT EVER ANYBODY EXPECTED THAT. WHAT I DID TRY TO CREATE A LITTLE BIT SMALLER LIST. AND THIS IS WHERE JUMP IN HERE AND INTERRUPT ME.

BUT I THINK BASED ON THE QUESTIONS THAT I'VE RECEIVED FROM YOU ALL, SOME OF MAYBE YOUR PRIORITY OR YOUR INTEREST MAY LAY IN SOME OF THESE PROJECTS. SO I PAIRED THIS LIST DOWN A LITTLE BIT. SO THIS IS ON PAGE EIGHT I DID PUT THERE IS A HANDOUT SO YOU CAN GO ALONG WITH THIS. THAT'S THIS DOCUMENT. THIS IS ON PAGE EIGHT OF THAT LIST. BECAUSE WE WERE HAVING THE CONVERSATION AT THE LAST MEETING ABOUT WHAT WAS LEFT IN THE 2018 BOND PROJECT THAT WASN'T DONE.

AND SO I LISTED THESE HERE PROPOSITION A HARRINGTON PARK PHASE TWO PARKS DEPARTMENT HAS GOTTEN BACK TO ME, AND THEY SAID THEY THINK THE ESTIMATE IS ABOUT $3.5 MILLION. THERE'S NO FUNDING AVAILABLE LEFT OVER WITH THE 2018 BOND PROJECT FOR THAT. SO THE FUNDING GAP IS ABOUT 3.5 MILLION FOR THAT PHASE TWO. THERE'S THE MAIN STREET OF CAMP WISDOM THAT WE TALKED ABOUT. WE ESTIMATE 8 TO 10 MILLION IN TOTAL FOR THAT WHOLE PROJECT. THERE'S 1.5 MILLION. SO THERE'S A FUNDING GAP OF SIX AND A HALF TO 8.5 MILLION ROUGHLY. NOW, THIS IS THE ONE THAT WE DID TALK ABOUT. I WAS TELLING YOU, WE'RE CURRENTLY TALKING WITH COG AND WE'RE PURSUING SOME OPPORTUNITIES AND SOME GRANT FUNDING OPPORTUNITIES AND SOME OTHER WAYS, MAYBE TO DO THIS SO THAT WE'RE STILL TRYING TO, AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE, MAKE SOME IMPROVEMENTS BASED ON THE INTENT OF THAT. BUT IT'S PROBABLY NOT GOING TO BE TO THE FULL SCALE. DOING OF THAT WHOLE INTERSECTION THAT WAS ORIGINALLY TALKED ABOUT THE SERVICE CENTER. WE'VE TALKED ABOUT A RANGE 10 TO 12 MILLION.

WE CURRENTLY HAVE 2 MILLION LEFT IN THE 2018 BOND PROJECT, ESSENTIALLY FOR THE SERVICE CENTER. I ALSO PUT THIS ON HERE BECAUSE WE HAVE 2 MILLION IN INTEREST REVENUE FROM THE 2018 BOND THAT HAS TO BE USED FOR ONE OF THE ITEMS WITH THE 2018 BOND. SO WE ACTUALLY DO HAVE $4

[00:05:07]

WE'VE TALKED ABOUT POLICE AND PUBLIC SAFETY, 8 TO 12 MILLION. THERE'S NO FUNDING SOLUTION CURRENTLY IDENTIFIED. WE'VE TALKED ABOUT IMPROVEMENTS TO FIRE STATION TWO. WE'VE TALKED ABOUT FIRE STATION THREE, WE'VE TALKED ABOUT REC CENTER IMPROVEMENTS AND THEN SOME GENERAL RELATED STUFF. IS THAT FAIR TO SAY THAT THAT'S MAYBE WHERE SOME OF YOUR INTEREST IS? IS THERE SOMETHING I MISSED IN TERMS OF ARE THOSE SOME OF THE MORE? OKAY, I WANTED TO PARE IT BACK A LITTLE BIT SO WE COULD JUST KIND OF FOCUS ON SOMETHING ELSE. CAN I MAKE A COMMENT IS MORE FOR OUR THINKING. JUST PUT ON THE TABLE THE I WAS INTIMATELY INVOLVED IN THE CAMP WISDOM RAILROAD GRADE THING, ESPECIALLY WHEN I WAS WITH THE COG, AND I WORKED REAL HARD TO GET THEM SO THAT THEY COULD WORK WITH THE GRANT, AND SO THAT WE COULD ACTUALLY QUALIFY FOR FEDERAL MONEY. THAT HAS BEEN A PROBLEM FOR THE CITY FOR, WHAT, 30 YEARS, 40 YEARS? AND LOOKING AT THIS LIST OF WHAT IS BEFORE US FOR SOMETHING TO BE DONE, MY THINKING, AND I ALMOST HATE TO SAY IT BECAUSE I WAS SUCH A PROPONENT OF THE THING, IS TO DROP IT AND JUST KIND OF PUT IT AWAY. LET'S LIVE WITH IT FOR ANOTHER 20. BUT THE START OF THE PROCESS FOR THE GRANTS, LET THOSE GRANTS WORK GET AS MUCH AS WE POSSIBLY CAN. AND THEN IF THE GRANTS COME THROUGH, THEN THE CITY COUNCIL AND MAYBE EDC CAN LOOK AT FUNDING THE REST OF WHATEVER REMAINS INTO FIXING THAT GRANT. THE GRADE, WHICH IS BIG BUCKS. YOU KNOW, WE'RE TALKING SIX AND A HALF TO $8 MILLION. SO IF THE COG COMES THROUGH AND FEDERAL MONEY COMES THROUGH AND COG COMES THROUGH, MAYBE WE CAN GET LIKE 4 OR 5 MILLION FROM THAT. AND THEN IN A COUPLE, THREE YEARS FROM NOW, MAYBE THE CITY CAN LOOK AT FUNDING THAT GAP. LOOKING AT THIS LIST OF WHAT'S IMPERATIVE FOR WHAT WE NEED IN THE CITY TODAY, I'M THINKING, JUST TAKE JUST TAKE THAT OFF THE LIST OF WHAT WE NEED TO BE CONSIDERING, BECAUSE IT'S A TOUGH NUT. IT'S A, YOU KNOW, IS IT GOING TO ARE WE GOING TO CRACK IT? I DON'T THINK SO. AND EVEN IF WE GO TO THE CITY AND PUT THIS IN THE LISTING FOR THE BOND, IT'S GOING TO BE A TOUGH SELL FOR US TO THE CITY COUNCIL TO SELL TO THE CITIZENS. LET'S CONTINUE TO LOOK FOR ANOTHER $8 MILLION FOR THAT GRADE. SO MY THINKING, MR. CHAIR AND VICE CHAIR, IS THAT KIND OF PUT THAT ON THE SIDE, KNOWING THE IMPERATIVE AND WHAT WE CAN AND CAN'T DO WITH THE MONEY. WHAT'S A BETTER PRIORITY TO THINK ABOUT AND NOT FOCUS ON THAT ONE? I JUST WANT TO PUT THAT ON THE TABLE FOR YOUR THINKING. SORRY TO INTERRUPT.

MR. NO, I THINK I APPRECIATE THAT. I SEE SOME HEAD NODDING, BUT I MEAN, IS EVERYBODY I DRAW A LINE THROUGH THAT ONE? IS EVERYBODY KIND OF I'M NOT ASKING YOU JUST KIND OF GENERAL STRAW POLLS TYPE THING. YOU CAN DRAW A LINE THROUGH THAT FOR ME. YEAH. OKAY. THANKS. PERFECT. OKAY.

THAT'S VERY HELPFUL. OKAY. SO NOW LOOK OUR GAP. WE'RE DOWN TO WHAT, 24 MILLION TO 39 MILLION OR SOMETHING. ALL RIGHT, I WANT TO TALK TO YOU JUST A LITTLE BIT. THIS SPECIFICALLY IS THE SLIDE I WANT TO I SHARED THAT I SHOWED THIS, BUT I'M GOING TO GIVE YOU ANOTHER LOOK AT THIS IN SOME DETAIL. THIS WHAT ERICA WAS ASKING ME ABOUT KIND OF TOWARDS THE END OF LAST WEEK. THIS IS THE SAME EXACT SLIDE THAT WAS ACTUALLY IN THE SAME POWERPOINT AS YOUR VERY FIRST MEETING.

BASICALLY, WHAT I'M SHOWING YOU HERE IS WHAT THE CITY'S DEBT TAX RATE IS. AND I'M EXPLAINING THAT IN A LITTLE BIT MORE DETAIL. BUT WHEN WE LOOK AT THE OVERALL TAX RATE FOR THE CITY, IT'S COMPRISED OF ACTUALLY TWO THINGS. IT'S THE DEBT TAX RATE OR THE INS TAX RATE. AND IT'S ALSO THE OPERATIONS TAX RATE. COMBINED. THEY MAKE THE TAX RATE THAT WE A LOT OF TIMES JUST REFER TO AS THE TAX RATE. BUT THAT'S WHAT THAT IS. SO YOU CAN SEE YOU KNOW BACK IN 2015 IT WAS $0.07. IT'S COME DOWN OVER TIME GOES BACK UP. IF WE TAKE OUT ANOTHER BOND AND THEN COMES BACK DOWN. GENERALLY SPEAKING I KNOW WE HAD A LITTLE BIT OF A CONVERSATION. IF WE WERE TO DO ABOUT A $25 MILLION BOND, ABOUT 4.5% INTEREST, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT $1.9 MILLION DEBT SERVICE PAYMENT PER YEAR, WHICH EQUATES TO ABOUT 3 OR $0.04. I'M GOING TO I'M GOING TO SKIP OVER THIS BECAUSE I WANT TO SHOW YOU THIS A DIFFERENT WAY. THAT MAY BE A LITTLE BIT EASIER. THIS ALSO THIS SLIDE I SHARED THIS LAST TIME. THIS IS SPECIFICALLY TO THE AGAIN, THE DEBT SERVICE RATE AND WHAT THE DEBT SERVICE RATES LOOK LIKE. IF THE ENTIRE DEBT SERVICE PAYMENT HAS TO BE BORNE BY THE GENERAL FUND. THAT'S WHY I WANT TO GET INTO SOME DETAIL AND SHOW YOU A COUPLE THINGS

[00:10:06]

WHAT'S IT ACTUALLY MEAN IN DOLLARS FOR A $250,000 HOME, A $400,000 HOME, A $550,000 HOME? WHAT'S IT MEAN? SO CURRENTLY, THE CURRENT FISCAL YEAR THAT WE'RE IN IS THE TAX RATE IS $0.61. SO A $250,000 HOUSE PAYS 15 TO 25. A $400,000 HOUSE OF THE TAXABLE VALUE PAYS 2440, AND A 550 PAYS 3355. THAT IS JUST THE DUNCANVILLE THAT DOES NOT INCLUDE SCHOOL. THAT DOESN'T INCLUDE COUNTY, THAT'S JUST DUNCANVILLE. I JUST WANT TO BE VERY CLEAR ABOUT THAT. SO WHAT I DID HERE WAS I FACTORED IN THAT 250,400 AND $550,000 HOME. THE MARKET IS STARTING TO COOL OFF A LITTLE BIT. GENERALLY, NATIONAL RATES IN TERMS OF THE PRICES OF HOMES TENDS TO GO UP, GIVE OR TAKE, 3% A YEAR. SO FACTORING THAT IN NOW AND WHAT IT WOULD LOOK LIKE OVER THE NEXT COUPLE OF YEARS THROUGH THE YEAR 2030, WHAT THE DIFFERENCE WOULD BE FOR THOSE HOMES, THE VALUE, THE TAXABLE VALUE OF IT, AND THE TAX RATE. IN A MOMENT, I'M GOING TO SHOW YOU THE STRATEGIES ON HOW WE GET TO THESE TAX RATES. BUT AGAIN I JUST SHOWED YOU FOR FISCAL YEAR 2658 $0.59, THE ACTUAL TAXABLE WOULD ACTUALLY GO DOWN A FEW DOLLARS 27 WOULD GO DOWN A FEW MORE. I DO THINK THERE WOULD BE A LITTLE BIT OF A TIGHTENING IN 2028 IF WE DO TAKE A BOND ONLINE, BUT I REALLY, TRULY BELIEVE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PENNIES, NOT EXTENSIVE AMOUNTS. WE ALREADY SAID IT'S PROBABLY 2 TO $0.03 IS WHAT THE DEBT SERVICE RATE WOULD BE. THERE WOULD BE A LITTLE BIT OF A TIGHTENING. NOW WE ONE OF THE OTHER FACTORS THERE'S WHEN YOU'RE WORKING ON TAX RATES AND OF COURSE YOU JUMP IN HERE IF I'M EXPLAINING THIS INCORRECTLY. BUT WHEN YOU'RE WORKING ON THIS STUFF THERE'S A BUNCH OF LEVERS. THINK OF IT LIKE A ALMOST LIKE AN AMUSEMENT RIDE. YOU'RE MOVING LEVERS BACK AND FORTH AND EVERYTHING, AND YOU'RE TRYING TO MINIMIZE THE FISCAL IMPACT TO THE HOMEOWNER, TO THE PROPERTY OWNER AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE. SO YOU'RE LOOKING AT THINGS LIKE FUND BALANCE. YOU'RE LOOKING AT THINGS LIKE WHAT WHAT MONIES CAN GO INTO OTHER FUNDS. YOU'RE LOOKING AT HOW MUCH MONEY DO WE HAVE COMING IN FROM GRANTS? WHAT ARE ALL THE OTHER SOURCES. SO THERE'S A LOT OF FACTORS THAT GO INTO THIS, AND THAT'S WHY IT GETS HARD TO ESTIMATE IN THE OUT YEARS. AND ON TOP OF THAT YOU HAVE THE TAX CAP, THE STATE REGULATORY STUFF OR THE MAXIMUM THAT WE CAN IMPOSE WITHOUT GOING TO THE VOTERS. WHAT I'M TRYING TO SHOW YOU HERE IS ABOUT WHAT I BELIEVE IT WOULD BE WITHOUT HAVING TO GO TO VOTERS, MEANING KEEPING IT ANY INCREASES OR IN KEEPING THE TAX RATE, EVEN THOUGH IT WOULD SHOW A DECREASE, KEEPING THAT TAX RATE BELOW THAT AMOUNT, THAT WOULD HAVE TO GO TO VOTERS. NOW, THIS IS NOT THE NO NEW REVENUE RATE. I WANT TO BE CLEAR ABOUT THAT, BECAUSE THERE WOULD STILL BE AN UPTICK IN REVENUE IN EACH OF THESE SCENARIOS FOR THIS, FOR THE CITY OVERALL, BECAUSE THE TOTAL TAXABLE VALUE WOULD GO UP ABOUT 3%. BUT HERE'S WHAT IT WOULD ACTUALLY MEAN TO THOSE HOMES OVER HOMES. EVERYBODY FOLLOW ME ON THAT. OKAY. BUT GOING BACK, JUST TO BE CLEAR. AND MAKING SURE THAT THE DEBT RATE FOR EACH FISCAL YEAR DOES INCLUDE BOTH THE INS AND THE O&M, DOES. IT DOES SO. I'M THINKING ABOUT MY

[00:15:09]

I KNOW WHAT I JUST PAID FOR MY PROPERTY TAXES AND IT'S LIKE DOUBLE FOR THAT. I'M NOT I DON'T HAVE A 550 HOUSE, BUT MY PROPERTY TAXES FOR THIS FISCAL YEAR WERE ABOUT DOUBLE OF THAT.

3342 CORRECT. WITH THE SCHOOL AND WITH THE COUNTY. YEAH. THAT'S WHY. SO IT'S THAT'S WHAT I'M THINKING. WE GOT TO PLANT IN OUR BRAINS THAT HOW ARE WE GOING TO SELL THIS TO THE CITIZENS? I KEEP THINKING ABOUT WHAT YOU ASKED ALL THE TIME. I KEEP THINKING ABOUT WHAT DID IT. WHAT DID? ERIC ASKED. YEAH. AND THIS IS GOING TO BE A VERY. IT'S ALMOST LIKE WHAT THE SCHOOL HAD TO DO WHEN THEY WENT FOR THEIR BOND WAS LAST YEAR. YEAR BEFORE THAT, THE, THE MARKETING THAT THEY HAD TO DO TO EXPLAIN TO PEOPLE WHAT WE'RE DOING AND WHY WE'RE DOING IT, HOW IT'S NOT THIS AND IT IS THAT. I THINK WE'RE FACING THAT AS WELL. ABSOLUTELY, ABSOLUTELY. AND I INCLUDED IT IN THAT ATTACHMENT THAT I SENT YOU. BUT THAT MARKETING PIECE THAT WAS DONE IN 2018, THAT WAS A FOUR PAGE FLIER. YEAH, I BROUGHT IT. IT'S ON MY IT'S ACTUALLY MY. YEAH.

BUT IT WAS ACTUALLY A FOUR PAGE FLIER RIGHT FRONT AND BACK OF TWO DIFFERENT PAGES THAT ACTUALLY SPELLED IT ALL OUT. THE DIFFERENT PROPOSITIONS, THE FISCAL IMPACT. WE'RE ABSOLUTELY GOING TO HAVE TO DO SOMETHING LIKE THAT. SO LOOKING AT GOING BACK TO. WHAT'S HER FACE HILLTOP PROVIDED. YES, I SEE THIS AND I GET IT. IS THIS MATRIX THAT HILLTOP PROVIDED ON PAGE 14 OF THE PACKAGE? JUST A LITTLE MORE SIMPLE EXPLANATION, BOTH FOR US AND COUNCIL AND CITIZENS TO LOOK AT THAT MATRIX INSTEAD OF. SURE, HOW ARE WE PLAYING WITH THIS? SO HERE'S THE THING. HILLTOP.

RIGHT. SO WHAT THEY PROVIDED YOU WAS WHAT A LOT OF FINANCIAL PLANNERS DON'T DO. AND I'VE WORKED WITH A TON OF THEM THERE BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE I MEAN THIS IS THEIR JOB RIGHT. SO THEY'RE GOING TO PROVIDE YOU THE MOST FISCALLY CONSERVATIVE MODEL THAT THERE IS IN THE WORST POSSIBLE CASE SCENARIO. WHAT I MEAN BY THAT, IN TERMS OF THE BIGGEST IMPACT TO THE TAXPAYER, RIGHT. BUT THEY'RE ALSO SAYING THAT IT ALL HITS THE GENERAL FUND. AND I'M NOT CONVINCED THAT IT ALL HAS TO HIT THE GENERAL FUND. THAT'S WHAT I WANT TO TALK TO YOU ABOUT TONIGHT. SO THEY'RE SHOWING A WORST CASE SCENARIO IS WHAT I WOULD SAY. I THINK I HAVE A BETTER SOLUTION FOR YOU. DOES DOES YOUR SOLUTION STILL FOLLOW THE WRAPAROUND STRUCTURE VERSUS THE LEVEL STRUCTURE? IT DOES.

YES. WHAT'S THE VALUE OR WHAT'S THE VALUE OF THE OTHER DEBT COMING IN TO THE 25 MILLION FOR THE WRAPAROUND. THERE'S PROS AND CONS TO IT I THINK. AND THAT'S SOMETHING WHERE THEY'LL HAVE TO BE SOME ADDITIONAL CONVERSATION. RIGHT. BUT MY BIGGEST QUESTION ABOUT THAT WHEN WE GOT THAT PROPOSAL EARLIER THIS YEAR, RIGHT, RATES WERE DOING A LITTLE BIT BETTER THAN YOU'RE DOING RIGHT NOW. YEAH. SO I'M NOT SO SURE THAT IT'S STILL ADVANTAGEOUS TO DO THAT IF WE WERE TO GO TO BOND RIGHT NOW. BUT KEEP IN MIND, WE'RE NOT GOING TO GO TO BOND RIGHT NOW, EVEN IF WE SAY THIS. YES. AND THIS GOES FORWARD AND IT GOES TO COUNCIL AND WE GO TO VOTERS IN NOVEMBER. YOU'RE PROBABLY TALKING ABOUT END OF 26, BEGINNING OF 27 BEFORE YOU EVER GO TO A BOND. SO RATES COULD LOOK DIFFERENT AT THAT POINT. RIGHT. THAT'S WHY THAT'S WHERE YOU SEE A TIGHTENING HERE IN 28, BECAUSE THAT'S WHERE THE FIRST DEBT SERVICE PAYMENT WOULD ACTUALLY HIT THE BOOKS WOULD BE IN THE FISCAL YEAR 28. SO THAT'S WHERE YOU SEE A LITTLE BIT OF A DECLINE. AND THEN YOU SEE A LITTLE BIT OF A BUMP BACK UP. THAT'S WHY. OKAY. OKAY. YEAH.

BECAUSE AS OF TODAY MUNICIPAL BONDS FOR AA AND A2 ARE 50 BASIS POINTS. MORE THAN THAT MATRIX.

RIGHT? I WAS JUST FUNNY. CURIOUS TO KNOW WHAT THEY'RE SELLING FOR TODAY. YEAH. SO EVEN THAT'S OUTDATED. CORRECT? RIGHT. AND WE'LL HAVE TO UPDATE ALL THAT IF THIS MOVES FORWARD. RIGHT.

OBVIOUSLY. YES. GO AHEAD INSTALL THIS. IF PROPERTY VALUES GO DOWN. SO GREAT QUESTION. RIGHT.

SO THEN YOU GO BACK TO BASICALLY IT BECOMES A $250,000 HOUSE. BUT WE'RE STILL GOING TO HAVE A CAP BECAUSE OF THE STATE, THE STATE WITH THEIR TAX CAP. THAT'S ALMOST LIKE A SAFETY NET INTENTIONALLY THAT WAS PUT IN FOR THE RESIDENTS. SO WE'RE STILL GOING TO HAVE LIMITATIONS.

SO WHEN YOU GET DOWN HERE TO YEAR 28, LET'S HYPOTHETICALLY SAY THAT THE HOUSE IS NOT WORTH 273,000. INSTEAD IT'S WORTH 250,000 AND WE HAVE $0.56. SO WHAT WE WERE TALKING ABOUT WAS A $4 INCREASE FOR THAT FISCAL YEAR 28 BUDGET, AND HAVE TO DO THE CALCULATION BACK OUT, BUT YOU'RE STILL GOING TO PROBABLY HAVE A TAX RATE OF SOMEWHERE IN THAT 56, $0.57 BECAUSE OF THE TAX CAP. IT'S OUR OUR WINDOW TO WORK ON PROPERTY TAX REVENUE COMING INTO THE BUDGET IS SO TIGHT

[00:20:10]

IT MAKES IT SUPER, SUPER TIGHT, BUT WE STILL HAVE THE ABILITY TO DO IT. IT'S A GREAT QUESTION.

AND IN SETTING THE TAX RATE, THE STATE ALLOWS MUNICIPALITIES TO SET A TAX RATE HIGH ENOUGH TO PROVIDE FOR PRINCIPAL AND INTEREST PAYMENTS ON DEBT. AND SO YOU ALSO HAVE THE CEILING. SO CORRECT. WHATEVER IT IS THAT IS LEFT BETWEEN THE TAX RATE AND THE CEILING THEN IS FOR OPERATIONS AND MAINTENANCE. THAT IS CORRECT. AND IT'S ALMOST LIKE YOU END UP DOING IT BACKWARDS.

YOU'RE LIKE, OKAY, HERE'S ALL OUR OBLIGATIONS, HERE'S ALL OUR DEBT SERVICE. AND THEN I LITERALLY WE'RE GOING THROUGH THIS EXERCISE RIGHT NOW. THESE GUYS WILL TELL YOU IT'S LIKE, OKAY, I NEED YOU TO FIGURE OUT A WAY TO TRIM IT OR THE FIRE DEPARTMENT BY 5%. I NEED YOU TO LOOK FOR OTHER WAYS OF FUNDING IT AND THOSE TYPES OF THINGS. AND THAT'S THE EXERCISE THAT WE GO THROUGH EVERY SINGLE YEAR, BECAUSE WE'RE WORKING BACKWARDS FROM THAT, THAT ABILITY. SO I WANT TO SHOW YOU A FEW MORE THINGS IN TERMS OF, IN TERMS OF THIS, SOME OTHER FUNDING SOLUTIONS. I JUST WANT TO BE VERY TRANSPARENT ABOUT MONEY THAT'S AVAILABLE. WE TALKED ABOUT THE $2 MILLION APPROXIMATELY FOR THE SERVICE CENTER. WE TALKED ABOUT THE $2 MILLION IN INTEREST THAT'S AVAILABLE CURRENTLY. OUR GENERAL FUND FOR THE GENERAL FUND, UNASSIGNED FUND BALANCE HAS APPROXIMATELY $21 MILLION IN IT. OUR FUND BALANCE POLICY SAYS THERE SHOULD BE NO MORE THAN ABOUT 17 MILLION. THAT MEANS WE'RE CURRENTLY ABOUT $3 MILLION MORE IN UNASSIGNED FUND BALANCE THAN WHAT WE SHOULD HAVE PER THE POLICY. SO AS PART OF YOUR DELIBERATIONS, YOU MAY WANT TO SAY TO COUNCIL, WE'D RECOMMEND THAT YOU FUND X PROJECT WITH X NUMBER OF DOLLARS, PERHAPS USING SOME OF THAT. I LISTED THIS AGAIN JUST IN THE SPIRIT OF TRANSPARENCY. THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION CURRENTLY HAS ABOUT $7 MILLION IN UNASSIGNED FUND BALANCE. IF THEY WERE FOLLOWING, THAT'S WHY THERE'S AN ASTERISK. IF THEY WERE FOLLOWING THE SAME FUND BALANCE POLICY, THE CAP WOULD BE ABOUT 2 MILLION, MEANING THEY HAVE 4 MILLION. BUT THERE'S ADDITIONAL STRINGS THAT GO WITH THAT. THAT CAN'T JUST BE CARTE BLANCHE FOR ANYTHING. AND THEN OUR UTILITY FUND CURRENTLY HAS ABOUT $11 MILLION. OUR FUND BALANCE POLICY SAYS WE SHOULD HAVE ABOUT 9 MILLION, MEANING WE HAVE ABOUT $2 MILLION. YES, SIR.

AND SO THE NUMBERS THAT WE'VE BEEN TOSSING AROUND IN TERMS OF WHAT WOULD ADEQUATELY FUND THESE PROJECTS, LET'S SAY, FOR INSTANCE, THE POLICE BUILDING, WE'RE THINKING $10 MILLION ON THE LOW END FOR $1 MILLION ON OUR HIGH END. THAT GETS US A BUILDING. YES. SO WHAT SOURCE OF FUNDS DO WE TURN TO GET THE PLACE READY FOR OCCUPANCY? GREAT QUESTION. AND THAT IS EXACTLY WHERE YOU MIGHT WANT TO THINK ABOUT SOME OF THESE TWO. RIGHT? I WANT TO SHOW YOU SOME DIFFERENT SCENARIOS JUST FOR A QUESTION. IF I GO BACK TO THIS, ARE THERE ANY REGULATIONS OR CONSTRAINTS ON USING THE UTILITY FUND BALANCE FOR ANYTHING OTHER THAN UTILITY PROJECTS LIKE, CAN WE USE THAT MONEY FOR OCCUPANCY OF THE POLICE STATION OR SOMETHING, SAY THAT YOU CAN'T TOUCH IT. IT'S GOT TO GO SOMEWHERE HERE. SO PRETTY MUCH LET ME JUST SAY, IN SOME OF THE

[00:25:05]

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

SO IF WE WERE LOOKING AT FOUR AND A HALF AND I JUST RAN THE NUMBERS HERE QUICK TO 5.5% INTEREST ON $8 MILLION, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT A $600,000 ANNUAL DEBT SERVICE PAYMENT, 660 FOR THAT FIVE AND A HALF FOR 20 YEARS. OKAY. SO WHEN YOU'RE LOOKING AT THE BUDGET FOR THE UTILITY FUND, THE UTILITY FUND, THAT'S OBVIOUSLY WATER, SEWER, IT'S ALL THOSE DIFFERENT THINGS THAT ARE UTILITY FUND. THERE'S ABOUT $5.5 MILLION A YEAR ALREADY BUDGETED FOR CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PROJECTS. THIS JUST BECOMES A MATTER OF OKAY, WE ACKNOWLEDGE THAT THOSE PROJECTS ARE NEEDED AND WE'RE GOING TO KEEP DOING THOSE, BUT MAYBE WE REDUCE THAT NUMBER FROM 5.5 MILLION TO 4.5, AND WE ABSORB THAT ENTIRE $600,000 PAYMENT, NO ADDITIONAL FEES, ZERO IMPACT TO THE RESIDENTS JUST BECOMES A BUDGETARY STRATEGY. AND IT WOULD TAKE CARE OF AT THAT POINT IN THIS SCENARIO. NOW YOU HAVE $12 MILLION TO GO AHEAD AND BUILD THE ENTIRE NEW SERVICE CENTER WITH ZERO IMPACT TO THE PROPERTY OWNER, THE TAXPAYERS, AND IT WOULD STILL, FOR WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, NO, GO AHEAD. WHAT YOU'RE SAYING THEN IS THAT THE $25 MILLION BOND, ESSENTIALLY THIS $8 MILLION CAN COME OUT OF THAT. YES. SO THAT, YES, $25 MILLION STILL STAYS AND WE DON'T HAVE TO. IT WAS ALMOST LIKE 33. EXACTLY. RIGHT. SO IT CREATES A HYPOTHETICAL $33 MILLION CIP FUND. CORRECT. SO NOW THAT $25 MILLION, WE JUST HYPOTHETICALLY SPENT EIGHT HERE, I STILL HAVE 17 MILLION RIGHT? OF THE 25. SO I DID THE SAME THING. IF YOU WERE TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THE POLICE. RIGHT. SO POLICE REMEMBER WE HAVE MORE LIMITED OPTIONS IN TERMS OF POLICE OR FIRE FOR THAT MATTER. SO WE JUST SAID WE HAVE 17. LET'S SAY WE'RE TALKING ABOUT 12 MILLION HERE AGAIN, 12 MILLION SAME 20 YEARS. YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT A DEBT SERVICE PAYMENT, GIVE OR TAKE $900,000 A YEAR. THE INS RATE IMPACT WOULD BE ABOUT $0.02. BUT REMEMBER BACK ON THIS OTHER CHART? I ALREADY SHOWED YOU WHAT OUR CAPS ARE. THAT'S WHERE THIS COMES INTO PLAY. YOU'RE GOING TO SEE A TAX RATE DECREASE OVERALL OF ABOUT A PENNY. BUT IT'S ABSORBED HERE. THAT'S WHY YOU GET THIS LITTLE BUMP IN THE FISCAL YEAR 28 PAYMENT. EVERYBODY FOLLOW ALONG WITH ME.

WHAT IS THE TAX RATE THAT WE WOULD HAVE TO GO TO THE VOTERS FOR. IT'S GENERALLY. SO WE WERE

[00:30:05]

RIGHT. BECAUSE THEN WE IT'S NOT GOING TO GO I MEAN THAT'S JUST NOT GOING TO GO ANYWHERE.

CORRECT. IT'D BE VERY DIFFICULT TO EXPLAIN WHY THE LAST TIME WE COULD GET A $20 MILLION WITHOUT A TAX INCREASE, AT THIS TIME, WE HAVE TO HAVE A TAX INCREASE IN ORDER TO DO THE SAME THING.

CORRECT. THAT'S DIFFICULT TO EXPLAIN TO THAT PERSON. IT'S IMPOSSIBLE. MAKE SURE YOU KEEP THAT WORD RATE IN THERE. YES. TAX RATE INCREASE BECAUSE IT IS A TAX INCREASE. YES. CORRECT.

YOU'RE 100% RIGHT. WELL SPELLING IT AS NO TAX INCREASE GOING BACK TO YOUR TAXES ARE GOING TO GO UP YOUR TAX RATE. SO REMEMBER WE WERE TALKING ABOUT AND I HAD THIS CONVERSATION WITH COUNCIL.

IF WE LOOKED AT THE $0.61 AS THE BASELINE RIGHT. THAT ESSENTIALLY I THOUGHT WE COULD BE GIVE OR TAKE NO TAX INCREASE. AND THAT'S WHAT I'M SHOWING YOU HERE. SO IF THE TAX WAS 1525 AND AGAIN THIS IS CITY, THIS ISN'T STATE OR THE SCHOOL DISTRICT OR THE COUNTY AND BLAH BLAH BLAH, BLAH BLAH.

THOSE 1525 YOU SEE HERE, IT'S 1529. OKAY. SO IT'S A $4 PER YEAR TAX INCREASE. YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT. BUT IT'S THE RATE COMES DOWN SIGNIFICANTLY. AND THAT IS THE TIGHTEST POINT THAT I CAN SEE REALLY OVER THE NEXT 1015 YEARS. THAT'S WHEN THAT FIRST DEBT SERVICE PAYMENT COMES ONLINE. AND THEN IT'LL CONTINUE TO GET THE DEBT SERVICE PAYMENT WILL STAY THE SAME, BUT THE RATE WILL CONTINUE TO DROP AT A MORE SIGNIFICANT RATE. IS ANYBODY WITH ME? OKAY. SO THEN GOING BACK OVER HERE TO THE POLICE, SAME THING $900,000. AND REMEMBER I SAID FOR EACH PENNY WE GET ABOUT $400,000. SO IT'S LIKE $0.02, TWO, THREE SOMETHING OR OTHER IS WHAT IT EQUATES TO THAT $900,000. BUT ESSENTIALLY IT'S $0.02 ON THE INS PAYMENT WOULD WOULD TAKE CARE OF THAT ENTIRE $12 MILLION, THAT $900 A YEAR PAYMENT, $900,000 A YEAR PAYMENT. SO WE SAID 17. IF WE BACKED OUT 12, WE HAVE FIVE LEFT. RIGHT. THIS IS WHERE YOU GUYS GET TO MAKE SOME DIFFICULT DECISIONS. WE TALKED ABOUT HARRINGTON PARK PHASE TWO. I KNOW YOU HAD SOME DISCUSSIONS ABOUT THAT. YOU WERE ASKING ME SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT THAT. THAT'S ABOUT 3.5 MILLION. WE TALKED ABOUT FIRE STATION THREE SATELLITE STATION. I'M GOING TO BE VERY CLEAR ABOUT THAT. THAT'S NOT A FULL BLOWN STATION, GIVE OR TAKE. PROBABLY $3.5 MILLION, THAT TYPE OF THING. REGARDLESS TO SAY, IF YOU WERE TO JUST FORGET THE PROJECT FOR A SECOND, IF YOU WERE TO HAVE $3.5 MILLION, THE TAX RATE WOULD BE. OR THE DEBT SERVICE PAYMENT, I SHOULD SAY, WOULD BE ABOUT 265, $275,000 A YEAR, 3.5 MILLION. THERE'S THE SAME TERMS, 3.5 MILLION. YOU HAVE A MILLION AND A HALF LEFT. I KNOW SOME OF YOU HAD REALLY TALKED ABOUT MAKING SOME IMPROVEMENTS TO FIRE STATION TWO. AGAIN, JUST TO KIND OF SHOW YOU THE DEBT SERVICE PAYMENT WOULD BE LESS THAN A PENNY. SO ALL IN ALL, YOU WOULD ACTUALLY BE BRINGING IN AND ACTUALLY CALCULATED THAT FOR YOU HERE. YEAH. SO JUST KIND OF LOOKING AT THESE NUMBERS AGAIN 25,000,008 12, THREE AND A HALF, ONE AND A HALF, $25 MILLION, 17 FOR THE GENERAL FUND, 8 MILLION FOR THE UTILITY FUND. ALL IN ALL YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT ABSORBING $1.2 MILLION ANNUALLY IN DEBT SERVICE INTO THE GENERAL FUND.

THAT'S GOING TO IF IT WAS THAT IN AND OF ITSELF, YOU WOULD BE LOOKING AT THREE CENT INCREASE

[00:35:02]

SO I KNOW WE KEEP SAYING 20, 25 MILLION KIND OF AS ARCADE, BUT SHOULD WE BE LOOKING AT UNDER THAT? BECAUSE YOU CAN'T REALLY GUARANTEE, OBVIOUSLY THAT YOU'RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO USE THAT CIP, YOU KNOW, BRING IT DOWN A LITTLE BIT. SO THAT WAY WE CAN PAY FOR SOME OF THE OTHER STUFF.

I MEAN, JUST, JUST HYPOTHETICALLY, COULD WE. SO THERE'S ANOTHER LEVER THAT I HAVEN'T REALLY TALKED ABOUT WITH YOU GUYS. THAT'S, THAT'S IT'S VERY, VERY VALID. RIGHT. AND I'M GLAD YOU ASKED THE QUESTION BECAUSE WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT IT. AND THIS IS REALLY GETTING INTO A LITTLE BIT IN THE WEEDS. BUT I HAVE NO PROBLEM IN TALKING ABOUT IT. AND THIS IS REALLY MORE IN OPERATIONS. BUT SOMETIME AROUND THAT 28 TIME PERIOD, WE SHOULD BE HAVING OUR NEW AUTOMATED METERING INFRASTRUCTURE COME ONLINE. WHAT THAT MEANS IS NOT NECESSARILY AN INCREASE IN, AGAIN, EXPENSE TO THE RESIDENTS, BUT WHAT IT MEANS IS A SIGNIFICANT SAVINGS ON EXPENSE TO THE CITY. WE ARE LOSING A RIDICULOUS AMOUNT OF WATER CURRENTLY ALL OVER THE CITY, AND THAT PROJECT WILL HELP ACTUALLY REDUCE EXPENSES. SO I TRULY I HAVE NO CONCERN AT ALL ABOUT THE UTILITY FUND ABSORBING A $600,000 PAYMENT. THAT WON'T EVEN BE A PROBLEM. VERY CONFIDENT. THAT QUESTION IS LIKE, THAT'S OUR JOB. OUR JOB IS TO GO THROUGH ALL THE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT THEY'VE COME TO US WITH AND SAY OF ALL THESE PROJECTS, HERE'S THE PRICE TICKET FOR THEM. WHICH ONES ARE WE GOING TO GO FORWARD TO THE COUNCIL AND SAY, THESE ARE THE ONES THAT WE THINK OUGHT TO BE FUNDED. THAT'S THAT'S A GREAT QUESTION. THAT'S OUR JOB. YEP.

SO, KIM, IF I COULD SPEAK DIRECTLY TO WHAT YOU BROUGHT UP. YEAH, I HAVE BEEN THINKING THE WHOLE TIME ABOUT LESS THAN 25 MILLION. OKAY. I'M STILL THINKING ABOUT. AND I THINK I PROVIDED FOR YOU APPROXIMATELY. AND I KNOW I DID IT IN A NARRATIVE ABOUT WHAT THOSE DEBT SERVICE PAYMENTS WOULD BE. THE THING IS ABOUT THESE NUMBERS IS THIS IS BASED ON 100% OF IT HITTING THE GENERAL FUND. WE DON'T HAVE TO DO THAT. WE'VE REALLY WE'VE DONE A LOT OF RESEARCH OVER THE LAST FEW WEEKS ABOUT THE UTILITY FUND AND OUR OPTIONS, AND THIS REALLY GIVES US SOME MORE FLEXIBILITY IN TERMS OF THE UTILITY FUND HELPING TO PAY THE EXPENSE RELATIVE TO THE SERVICE CENTER BACK A COUPLE OF MONTHS FROM THAT, FOR FROM THOSE FOUR POCKETS THAT YOU COULD HAVE PULLED FROM, CAN IT COME FROM ANY OF THOSE? WOULD THAT BE UTILITY? CAN IT COME FROM GENERAL OR IT WOULD HAVE TO COME FROM GENERAL OR POTENTIALLY IT COULD COME FROM DC, EDC WITH WITH SOME CAVEATS, THAT TYPE OF THING. THE UTILITY MIGHT BE ABLE TO HAVE A LITTLE BIT BECAUSE THEY DO HAVE IT RELATED NEEDS, BUT IT WOULD PROBABLY HAVE TO BE A PROPORTIONATE AMOUNT. LIKE FOR INSTANCE, IF IT WAS $1 MILLION, WE WOULD HAVE TO RUN SOME CALCULATIONS, BUT MAYBE THE MAXIMUM COULD BE 20% OF THE UTILITY FUND, THAT TYPE OF THING. SO OKAY, MY QUESTION IS WHEN WE WERE FIRST GIVEN THESE NUMBERS, THE 2 MILLION, THE 4 MILLION IN THE 2018 BOND, I THINK, I MEAN, I'LL JUST SPEAK FOR MYSELF. I WAS THINKING IN TERMS OF APPLYING THAT TO THE COST OF THE BUILDING, WHICH BROUGHT IT DOWN SIGNIFICANTLY.

AND SO IN MY MIND, I'M THINKING, WELL, THAT'S REALLY GOOD. WELL, NOW YOU'RE TALKING AS THOUGH,

[00:40:05]

NOW HE WAS ASKING ME A QUESTION ABOUT THE OPERATIONAL EXPENSE OF THE ACTUAL BUILDINGS. RIGHT. SO WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT IT, THE SERVICE CENTER IN A CASE, LET'S USE THAT AS AN EXAMPLE. IT ALREADY HAS ALL THE DESKS. IT ALREADY HAS ALL THE IT IT ALREADY HAS ALL THE PHONE. WILL THERE BE SOME EXPENSE WITH MOVING THAT OVER INTO A NEW BUILDING? YES, BUT WE'RE NOT.

IT'S NOT AN ASTRONOMICAL NUMBER. A LOT OF THAT COULD PROBABLY BE ABSORBED INTO OPERATIONS. I THINK ONE OF THE MORE CHALLENGING ONES WOULD BE ACTUALLY THE POLICE. AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PUBLIC SAFETY BUILDING. WE'RE TALKING ABOUT COURT AND THAT TYPE OF STUFF.

THERE WOULD BE SOME ADDITIONAL EXPENSE WITH OUTFITTING THAT. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE NUMBERS THAT ARE MORE REALISTIC AND INCLUDING ALL OF THAT, BECAUSE YOU CAN'T JUST HAVE AN EMPTY BUILDING, RIGHT? YEAH, I DON'T KNOW, TO BE HONEST WITH YOU, GIVEN THE TIME CONSTRAINTS THAT WE CAN PROVIDE THAT TO BE 100% HONEST WITH YOU. I GET WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. IT'S PROBABLY I MEAN, YOU COULD ESTIMATE I'M TRYING TO THINK OF WHEN I DID, I THINK WE ESTIMATED 200,000, GIVE OR TAKE. BUT A LOT OF THAT KIND OF STUFF IS ALSO BUDGETED IN THE OPERATIONAL BUDGET FOR THOSE TYPES OF IMPROVEMENTS. REALLY. I THINK NONE OF THAT COULD BE INCLUDED IN THE BOND ANYWAY. THAT'S PROHIBITED. THERE HAS TO BE THE FACILITY. SO THAT'S WHY I ASKED THE QUESTION, BECAUSE I ASKED I ASKED THE QUESTION UNDER THE ASSUMPTION, BASED ON MY EXPERIENCE, THAT FURNISHING A BUILDING, WHATEVER THAT TAKES IS, IS USUALLY COMES OUT OF OPERATING RESOURCES, RIGHT? YEAH. AND AGAIN, THAT MAY BE THINGS THAT HAVE TO BE BUDGETED. NOW, THE GOOD NEWS IS IN TERMS OF THE POLICE, RIGHT. THE IT'S ALREADY ALL HERE. THEY ALREADY HAVE THEIR COMPUTERS. THEY ALREADY BUDGET FOR COMPUTER REPLACEMENTS. THEY HAVE SOME ACCESS TO SOME SPECIFIC MONEY.

IF THERE'S ADDITIONAL NEEDS ONE TIME TYPE COSTS THAT THEY HAVE ACCESS TO A WHOLE SEPARATE FUND THAT IS COMPLETELY SEPARATE FROM ANY OF THIS. SO THE ASSET FORFEITURE FUND IS WHAT THAT'S CALLED. WOULD YOU AGREE WITH THAT? SOME OF THAT. YES, SIR. SO. I'M NOT, TO BE HONEST WITH YOU, FROM AN OPERATIONAL EXPENSE. I'M NOT SUPER WORRIED THERE WOULD BE SOME COST FOR PUBLIC WORKS, BUT A LOT OF THAT THEY ALREADY HAVE, IT'S A MATTER OF MAKING IMPROVEMENTS TO THAT BUILDING THE BIGGER EXPENSE WOULD BE POLICE. THEY HAVE A RESOURCE FOR THAT. AND THEN THEY MAY HAVE TO BUDGET AND THEY MAY HAVE TO DO IT A LITTLE BIT OVER A COUPLE OF YEARS TO GET THAT FULLY UP TO WHERE IT NEEDS TO BE. SO WE COULD THEORETICALLY USE THAT FULL 4 MILLION. FOR THE PROJECT FOR THE BUILDING. YES, WE ACTUALLY AND WE SHOULD BECAUSE IT WAS A BOND. SO YES.

NOT THE OPERATIONAL STUFF. RIGHT. SO. AND THIS MAY SEEM LIKE AN OFF THE WALL QUESTION, BUT. HOW MANY HOW MANY CAPITAL PROJECTS HAVE THE STAFF DONE SINCE THEY'VE BEEN HERE? I DON'T DOUBT THAT. THEY HAVE PROBABLY DONE CAPITAL PROJECTS SOMEWHERE ELSE. BUT YOU KNOW, HOW MANY OF THOSE OLD, YOU KNOW, 2018 PROJECTS HAVE BEEN DONE UNDER YOUR WATCH? SURE. SINCE I'VE BEEN HERE, WE DID. WE COMPLETED PROPOSITION C, WHICH WAS THE ENTIRE FIRE STATION. PROPOSITION D IS THE SERVICE CENTER THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT. PROPOSITION B WAS THE ROADWAY. I THINK AT THIS POINT, THE ONLY ONE THAT IS REALLY OUTSTANDING IS THE CAMP WISDOM AT MAIN, BECAUSE CEDAR RIDGE, WE'VE GOTTEN THAT TO A POINT WHERE THAT'S MOVING FORWARD. NOW, THAT'S FINISHING UP DESIGN, AND THAT'LL BE BREAKING GROUND BEFORE LONG. DANIEL NAILS DONE. THERE WAS OBVIOUSLY SOME DISCUSSION ABOUT THE BIKE LANE. SO THAT'S ALL BEEN IN THIS YEAR AND A HALF, TWO YEARS. AND THEN PROPOSITION A WAS ALL THE PARK STUFF. SO WE COMPLETED THE SPLASH PAD. WE COMPLETED KIDS VILLAGE. SINCE I'VE BEEN HERE WE DID SOME TRAIL IMPROVEMENTS. WE DID THE LAD

[00:45:05]

AND THEN THE LAST ONE IS SOME OF THE TRAIL IMPROVEMENTS UNDER PROPOSITION A. AND WE HAVE CURRENTLY BEEN GIVEN A GREEN LIGHT ON ABOUT $24 MILLION IN GRANTS THAT GO TOWARDS THAT. SO WE'VE FUNDED THAT. SO I LOST TRACK, BUT QUITE A FEW OF THE 2018 PROJECTS WE'VE DONE IN THE LAST YEAR AND A HALF. SO WHEN DID YOU SAY THE BIKE LANES WENT? WHEN DID THAT COME ABOUT? YES, THAT'S I'M GONNA DEFER TO YOU. YOU WERE THE MAYOR. I WAS OPPOSED TO THE BIKE LANES BECAUSE WHEN I LOOKED AT THE COST OF PUTTING BIKE LANES IN SUCH A SHORT STRETCH AND LOOKING AT THE CONSULTANT'S ADVICE, WHICH I DISAGREED WITH, THEY SAID THAT IF YOU PUT IN BIKE LANES, LIKE LOOKING AT DANIEL DALE, SIX LANES, IF YOU PUT IN BIKE LANES THAT CONSTRICT DANIEL DALE DOWN TO FOUR LANES, TRAFFIC WOULD SLOW DOWN. BALONEY. IT DOESN'T. THE HUMAN BODY DOESN'T DO THAT. THE BEHAVIOR BEHIND THE WHEEL DOESN'T DO THAT. SO MY CONDITION, MY COMPLAINT WAS PUT IN BIKE LANES IS STILL PEOPLE ARE STILL GOING TO GET KILLED AND PEOPLE ARE NOT GOING TO SLOW DOWN. THEY'RE STILL GOING TO DO 65 MILES AN HOUR DOWN DANIEL DILLON OR PUT IN BIKE LANES SO THEY MOW DOWN THE BIKE LANES. SO THAT'S WHY I VOTED AGAINST THE BIKE LANES. AND I STILL SAY THAT LOOKING AT DANIEL DANIEL DALE IS A PROBLEM BECAUSE IT WAS SIX LANES AND THEY DID A TRAFFIC STUDY AND THEY SAID, DANIEL DALE IS NOT USED TO ITS OPTIMUM CAPACITY BUILT FOR SIX LANES. I SAY THAT'S TRUE, BUT WHY NOT LOOK AT THAT AS AN AMENITY FOR THE CITY? BECAUSE PEOPLE LOOK AT THAT AT THE END OF THE DAY. YES, IT IS A CONDUIT BETWEEN THE WOODS AND CEDAR HILL AND DALLAS AND COMING OFF OF 67, NO QUESTION. I DON'T KNOW THE PERCENTAGE OF PEOPLE DRIVING DOWN DANIEL DALE THAT ACTUALLY LIVE IN THE CITY, BUT THEY USE IT AS A CONDUIT. AND I SAID, THAT'S GOOD FOR THE CITY. IT'S AN AMENITY. PEOPLE SAY, OH, YEAH, YOU KNOW, DAN DOES A GREAT STREET AT SIX LANES, AND I GET TO DO 65 MILES AN HOUR AND. BUT THE BOTTOM LINE WAS, IS THAT I JUST DIDN'T LOOKING AT DANIEL DALE AS A, AS A DEDICATED THOROUGHFARE WITH TWO LANES TAKEN AWAY FOR AUTOMOBILE TRAFFIC AND MAKE IT FOUR LANES, I JUST COULDN'T SEE IT. OKAY.

DID I DO OKAY? YEAH. NO, I THINK THAT'S THE SUMMARY. OF WHAT? THE WAY I UNDERSTAND THAT. BUT I WAS VOTED DOWN AND THEN IN IN ADDITION THOUGH WE DO HAVE I, IT WAS EITHER THE LAST MEETING IN MAY OR THE FIRST MEETING IN JUNE. SO THAT WOULD HAVE EITHER BEEN JUNE 3RD OR MAY 20TH SOMETHING OR OTHER. OUR ASSISTANT DIRECTOR OF PUBLIC WORKS DID A PRESENTATION TO COUNCIL ON GRANT OPPORTUNITY THAT WE'RE CURRENTLY. WE HAVE REALLY, REALLY GOOD CHANCE OF.

THEY'VE THEY'VE SAID TO US THAT IT LOOKS LIKE WE QUALIFY FOR AND IT WOULD BE PUTTING SIDEWALKS AND TRAILS ALL THE WAY DOWN DANIEL DALE, ALL THE WAY BACK UP. WHAT IS THAT, CEDAR RIDGE AND THEN BACK ACROSS WHEATLAND, BACK TO BERT ELEMENTARY SCHOOL. THAT'S ACROSS FROM ROTARY PARK.

SO. THAT. SIDEWALK SLASH TRAIL COULD POTENTIALLY ALSO BE DESIGNED SO THAT IT COULD POTENTIALLY ALSO INCLUDE A BIKE PATH. AND SO THAT'S STILL THAT'S THE SEPARATE. THAT'S THE COMPLETE STREET. STREET. CORRECT. BUT AS I UNDERSTAND IT'S WAY OFF TOPIC NOW. BUT AS I READ AND UNDERSTAND COMPLETE STREETS, YOU CAN'T CHERRY PICK. IF YOU DO COMPLETE STREET, IT'S 100% FULL COMPLIANCE WITH EVERY PIECE OF IT. YOU CAN'T SAY, I DON'T WANT TO DO THIS, I WANT TO DO THIS. COMPLETE STREET IS 100% COMPLIANCE. IF YOU CAN'T PLAY, THERE'S FEDERAL FUNDING, CORRECT? THAT'S WHAT IT IS. YEAH. THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU. QUESTION MORE FOR US GOING BACK TO THIS, THE 20 VERSUS 25 I THINK IT'S WE THIS IS WHERE WE GOT TO DECIDE WHICH

[00:50:07]

AND THOSE DELTAS BEGIN TO LOOK LIKE MAYBE WE CAN AFFORD THEM. BUT IT GOES RIGHT BACK TO YOUR QUESTION AGAIN, EVEN IF THAT IF THAT DELTA IS THIS SMALL, BETWEEN A $20 MILLION BOND AT 5% AND A $25 MILLION BOND AT 5%, WHAT DOES THAT DELTA INTO US? MAYBE IT'S NOT THAT MUCH MONEY, BUT TO THE CITIZENS, IT'S A LOT OF MONEY. YEAH, WELL, WHAT ABOUT WHAT? WHAT ABOUT AT SOME POINT IN THIS DISCUSSION, WE JUST GO AROUND THE TABLE AND SAY AND POLL EACH MEMBER AND SAY, THIS IS THE AMOUNT I'M COMFORTABLE WITH, AND THESE ARE THE THINGS THAT I THINK WE OUGHT TO DO WITH THE REQUEST AND SEE WHAT THE CONSENSUS IS. OKAY. YEAH. MR. NOLAN, YOU'VE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS MEETING FOR A LONG TIME. BEFORE YOU GO, YOU GO BACK TO THE PAGE THAT HAS THE MONEY THAT WE HAVE FOR THE DIFFERENT FUND BALANCES. AND THIS ONE. YEAH. THANK YOU.

OKAY. BUT I DID FOR MYSELF. I WENT THROUGH THE ENTIRE LIST AND I BROKE IT DOWN BETWEEN FACILITIES AND I CALLED IT AMENITIES AND OTHER AMENITIES. I PUT THE REC CENTER, THE DOG PARK, THE LAP PRESERVE AND THE LIBRARY. RIGHT. MAYBE I'LL THINK ABOUT THESE IF ANYTHING HAPPENS.

BUT I HAD POLICE AND COURT SERVICE CENTERS. FIRE STATION TWO, FIRE STATION THREE. AND THEN AT THE BOTTOM OF THE LIST, I HAD GENERAL IT IN THE FIELDHOUSE. CAN THOSE THINGS AT THE LOW END COME TO 22 FIVE AT THE LOW END? NOW THINKING ABOUT LOOKING AT THE WORST CASE, THE HIGH END. AND I'LL JUST HAVE TO ASK MR. FINCH A QUESTION DURING ALL OF THOSE OPTIONS A, B, C AND D, FIRE STATION NUMBER THREE WASN'T THERE. SO I'M THINKING WHAT'S THE INFERENCE? ARE THEY TRYING TO TELL US OR DO WE CONNECT THE DOTS. BECAUSE I THINK FIRE STATION NUMBER THREE WAS STILL IS A NECESSITY FROM WHAT I'M HEARING. BUT IT WASN'T IN ANY OF THOSE A, B, C OR OPTIONS THAT YOU GAVE ME. YOU DON'T HAVE TO ANSWER, BUT YOU WANT ME TO ANSWER. I'LL TELL YOU WHAT I WAS THINKING WHEN I PUT TOGETHER. I'LL JUST SHARE WITH YOU. AS WE CONTINUE TO WORK ON THE GENERAL FUND AND THE OPERATIONAL BUDGET. KEEP IN MIND ALL OF POLICE, ALL FIRE.

BASICALLY EXPENSES HAVE TO GO AGAINST THE GENERAL FUND. WE HAVE LIMITED OTHER AVENUES FOR THAT. THE CONCERN IS, I DON'T KNOW, WITHIN THE NEXT 3 TO 5 YEARS HOW WE ADD AN ADDITIONAL 21 FIREFIGHTERS. I CAN SEE ADDING A COUPLE A YEAR, MAYBE 100% HONEST. I THINK WE COULD GET CREATIVE ON MAYBE AND THE CHIEF AND I HAVE TALKED ABOUT IT WORKING, MAYBE DALLAS COLLEGE, MAYBE THERE'S SOME PARAMEDIC EMT TYPE STUFF WE CAN DO. AND EVEN THE COUNCIL TO BE HONEST. AND

[00:55:01]

SERVICE CENTER, THE POLICE FACILITY AND FIRE STATION NUMBER TWO, IMPROVEMENTS ON THE PUBLIC SAFETY SIDE OF THINGS ARE MY HIGHEST PRIORITIES. AND THEN IT AS WELL THROWING IN THERE, I DO.

[01:00:02]

THOSE ARE EXCEPT FOR THE LAB PROPERTY. THOSE ARE A LITTLE BIT LOWER ON THE COST. SO I WOULD LOVE TO SEE THAT PUT IN THERE SOMEWHERE. I THINK MY VOTE WOULD BE THE DOG PARK FOR THAT. I DO ALSO HAVE A QUESTION AS FAR AS THAT GOES. WHAT IS THE REALISTIC POSSIBILITY OF ALL OF THESE ONES DOWN HERE? REC CENTER, DOG PARK, LAB PROPERTY, FIELDHOUSE, ALL OF THOSE. WHAT IS THE REALISTIC POSSIBILITY THAT THAT THESE COULD BE DONE THROUGH ALTERNATIVE FUNDING OUTSIDE OF THE BOND? THE BEST CHANCE IS OF THOSE SPECIFICALLY IS THE FIELDHOUSE, BECAUSE WE HAVE SPECIAL STATE LEGISLATION THAT ALLOWS US TO USE HOTEL OCCUPANCY TAX FUNDS FOR IMPROVEMENTS IN THE FIELDHOUSE. SO FIELDHOUSE IMPROVEMENTS ACTUALLY CAN BE DONE. WE JUST HAVE INVESTED ABOUT A MILLION AND A HALF IN HVAC AND ROOF UPGRADES. WE'RE ACTUALLY TALKING ABOUT GETTING SOME QUOTES RIGHT NOW FOR PARKING LOT AND THOSE TYPES OF THINGS. AND THE PLAN IS ONCE WE HAVE THOSE ESTIMATES, TAKING ALL THAT TO COUNCIL AGAIN USING HOT FUNDS. SO THERE IS A FUNDING MECHANISM SPECIFICALLY FOR THE FIELDHOUSE OUTSIDE OF BONDING ALLOCATION. SOME OF THE OTHER ONES, LIKE WHAT YOU WERE ASKING ABOUT THE NATURE PRESERVE OR THE DOG PARK OR EVEN PHASE TWO OF HARRINGTON PARK. I MEAN, YOU'RE I THINK, YOU KNOW, HARRINGTON PARK PHASE TWO WAS 3.5 MILLION.

THE DOG PARK RIGHT ON THE LOW END IS 3 MILLION. HIGH END IS 3.5 MILLION. SO I MEAN THAT YOU'RE BASICALLY TALKING ABOUT THE SAME NUMBERS OR THERE IS PHASE, THE PHASE ONE OPTION FOR THE DOG PARK AS WELL. SO OKAY, SO ON MY LIST I HAVE OF COURSE PUBLIC SAFETY IS TOP PRIORITY.

WE ACTUALLY HAD TO CALL 911 TODAY. THE RESPONSE TIME WAS GREAT, BUT I WAS LISTENING WHEN IN THE EARLIER MEETINGS WE WERE TALKING ABOUT THE RESPONSE RATE TO DISTRICT FOUR IS COMPROMISED A BIT BECAUSE OF THE DISTANCE. SO THAT EXPLAINS MY REASONS FOR THE TOP PRIORITY FOR THE POLICE STATION. FIRE STATION. THIRD, IS IT. SEE HARRINGTON PARK. BECAUSE OF THE SAFETY IMPLICATIONS THERE, SOME OF THE DESCRIPTIONS THAT WERE TOLD IN THE IN SOME OF THE PREVIOUS MEETINGS, I'M NOT REALLY. AND OF COURSE THE FIRE STATION, I'VE SAID THAT I'M NOT REALLY SOLD SO MUCH ON THE DOG PARK IS SOME FLEXIBILITY THERE, BUT THAT'S NOT A TOP PRIORITY. AND THE FIELD HOUSE, KNOWING THAT WHEN WE HAD THE PRESENTATION FROM THE YOUNG LADY A COUPLE OF WEEKS AGO, THAT THERE IS SOME ADDITIONAL FUNDING THAT COULD BE USED IN PLACE OF THE BOND MONEY TO SUPPLEMENT THE FIELD HOUSE NEEDS. SO GUESS WHERE I AM? OKAY, I'M I'M GOING TO BE THE ODD MAN OUT. I'M LOOKING AT THESE NUMBERS AND I'M THINKING WE CAN FIND MONEY. WE CAN FIND LOTS OF MONEY IN SOME OF THESE OTHER PLACES. I MY TOP PRIORITY IS POLICE STATION, SERVICE CENTER. THOSE ARE THE TWO NON-NEGOTIABLES FOR ME. I MEAN, IF WE CAN SQUEEZE IN SOME OF THESE OTHER THINGS THAT PEOPLE ARE SAYING, I'M NOT AGAINST ALL THAT. I'M THINKING WITH, WITH THE MONEY THAT IS IN, YOU KNOW, ON THAT CHART THAT I ASKED YOU TO GO BACK TO. I'M THINKING IF WE DO A BOND BETWEEN 15 AND 20 MILLION AND THEN ALLOCATE THOSE FUNDS, WE'RE GOING TO END UP WHERE WE NEED TO BE. AND THAT'S THAT'S WHAT I'VE BEEN THINKING KIND OF ALL ALONG. SO. THE FUNNY THING, FUNNY THING WAS REAL FUNNY. BUT THE INTERESTING THING HAPPENED TO ME A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO. AND THAT

[01:05:04]

AND SO ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I REALLY ENJOY WHEN I WAS WORKING IS THAT I ALWAYS HAD MONEY TO BUY NICE THINGS, PARTICULARLY NICE THINGS TO WEAR. HOWEVER, SINCE I HAVE BEEN RETIRED, I HAVEN'T BOUGHT A SUIT. SO WHEN YOU SEE ME JUST THINK FIVE YEARS, TEN YEARS AND THAT'S ABOUT HOW OLD SOME OF THE STUFF IS. LOOKS GOOD ON ME AND I LIKE IT AN AWFUL LOT. I'M SURE YOU AGREE. BUT THE THING ABOUT THING ABOUT RETIREMENT IS THAT IF YOU'RE GOING TO BE IN IT TO WIN IT, YOU HAVE TO DISCIPLINE YOURSELF AND MAKE DO WITH WHAT YOU HAVE. AND SO. EVERYTHING THAT HAS BEEN PRESENTED TO US. IS A NECESSITY. WE LOVE TO HAVE IT. BUT I THINK THAT WE HAVE TO TAKE A LOOK AT THE BROADER PICTURE AND MAKE DIFFICULT DECISIONS. THAT'S WHY THEY CALL IT A BUDGET. I USED TO DO BUDGETS FOR OTHER PEOPLE, BUT NOW SINCE I'M RETIRED, I DO BUDGETS FOR MYSELF. AND IT'S DEFINITELY NOT THE SAME. LIKE FOR EXAMPLE, WASHING MACHINE BROKE. I CALLED SOMEBODY YESTERDAY. THEY CAME BY, THEY SAID $388. I SAID, NO, I'M GOING TO CALL THE NEXT GUY. WELL, THAT'S WHAT I USED TO TELL THE CITIES THAT I WORK FOR TO DO IT, YOU KNOW, GET THREE BIDS. WELL, I DIDN'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT BIDS UNTIL I RETIRED. NOW, YEAH, I WANT THE LOWEST COST. I WANT THE MOST FOR THE MOST FOR THE LEAST. BANG FOR THE BUCK. SO, HARVEY, WHAT ARE YOU DOING? THIS. HE IS WHERE I'M GOING WITH THIS. IS THAT. I THINK WE NEED TO BE STRATEGIC. I THINK WE NEED TO DO THIS CAPITAL BOND VERY CAREFULLY AND TAKE A BITE OF IT AT A TIME, BECAUSE, QUITE FRANKLY, WE DON'T KNOW WHERE THE ECONOMY IS GOING. BUT I CAN TELL YOU THIS WITH THE POLICE STATION COMES 12 NEW POSITIONS. THAT'S MY READING OF THE SURVEY. OKAY.

SO WHEN I SAY LOOK AT THE BIGGER PICTURE, LOOK AT NOT ONLY WHAT IT COSTS TO MAKE IT HAPPEN, BUT ALSO WHAT IT'S GOING TO COST TO KEEP IT. AND SO WITH THE WITH THE POLICE STATION COMES 12 NEW POSITIONS ACCORDING TO THE SALARY SURVEY. SO WE HAVE TO ACCOUNT FOR THAT. AND THE OTHER THING IS THAT AS WE MOVE FORWARD INTO THE FUTURE, SALARIES ARE NOT GOING TO GO DOWN. THEY'RE GOING UP. AND SO THE INCREASE FOR POLICE AND FIRE THAT WENT THROUGH A COUPLE OF MONTHS AGO, THAT'S NOT THE LAST ONE. THEY ARE GOING TO BE OTHERS. SO NOW WHEN WE LOOK AT THE GENERAL FUND, THE GENERAL FUND HAS TWO MAIN SOURCES OF REVENUE. ONE IS PROPERTY TAX AND THE OTHER ONE IS SALES TAX. AND I CAN TELL YOU PERSONALLY THAT I KNOW THAT THE. THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION STAFF IS DOING THEIR DEAD LEVEL BEST TO GET MORE BUSINESS TO DUNCANVILLE.

[01:10:09]

REMEMBER, DEPENDING ON THE TAX RATE IS ABOUT $400,000. SO THAT'S THAT'S ESSENTIALLY THE DIFFERENCE THAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT THERE. NOW AGAIN THOUGH KEEPING IN MIND THOSE LEVERS.

RIGHT. SO LIKE FOR INSTANCE, IF WE DID 20 MILLION YOU COULD STILL ALLOCATE THAT 8 MILLION TO THE UTILITY FUND AND THEN THE 12 MILLION TO THE GENERAL FUND, IT WOULD JUST REDUCE THE DEBT SERVICE PAYMENT TO THE $900,000, ESSENTIALLY TO THE GENERAL FUND, GIVE OR TAKE. SO. AND IT WOULD BE GOOD IF WE WERE ABLE TO DO SOME SOME BIG THINGS LIKE THAT WITH THE I MISSPOKE THE LAST TIME WITH A MINIMAL INCREASE IN OUR NEIGHBOR'S TAXES, WHATEVER. THAT IS, GOING ALONG WITH WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. PATRICK, THE I GOT QUESTIONS MANY, MANY TIMES, LIKE, WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO ABOUT MY PROPERTY TAXES? AND I SAID NOTHING. OUR TAX RATE IS WHAT OUR TAX RATE IS, IN FACT.

WE AS COUNCIL DREW IT DOWN OVER THE YEARS, BUT OUR PROPERTY TAXES WENT UP. AND WHAT WE HAVE TO LOOK AT IS NORTH TEXAS, BECAUSE I'VE EXPLAINED THIS A LOT. NORTH TEXAS IS THE VICTIM OF SUCH A VOLCANIC ECONOMIC ENGINE IN TERMS OF WHAT'S GOING ON IN NORTH TEXAS. AND YOU LOOK AT THE STATE OF TEXAS, THE NINTH LARGEST GROSS DOMESTIC PRODUCT IN THE WORLD IN TERMS OF THE GROWTH COMING INTO TEXAS. IT WAS JUST ANNOUNCED TODAY OR YESTERDAY THAT TEXAS INSTRUMENTS IS GOING TO PUT $60 BILLION IN TWO FACTORIES IN SHERMAN. SHERM IS NOT THAT FAR AWAY. BUT WHAT IS WHAT DOES THAT DO TO OUR PROPERTY TAXES? IT'S WE'RE STILL GOING TO BE IMPACTED BY WHAT'S GOING ON IN SHERMAN. WE'RE GOING TO BE IMPACTED BY WHAT'S GOING ON. SO EVEN THOUGH THAT'S ENNIS COUNTY, THEY LOOK AT WHAT'S GOING ON IN THIS WHOLE ECONOMIC ENGINE. IT GOES RIGHT TO YOUR POINT IN TERMS OF WE AS CITIZENS, WHAT'S THE BURDEN ON US. WE'RE GOING TO BE PAYING

[01:15:05]

SO NO MATTER WHAT WE DO AND WHAT COUNCIL DOES TO KEEP THAT TAX RATE BELOW THE. EVERY ONE OF US ARE GOING TO BE HIT IN OUR BACK POCKET BY PAYING MORE AND MORE AND MORE IN PROPERTY TAXES. LIKE SOMEBODY TOLD ME, ALL YOU DO IS YOU RENT YOUR HOUSE FROM THE STATE OF TEXAS. YOU DON'T KNOW.

YOU'RE JUST YOU'RE RENTING YOUR HOUSE FROM THE STATE OF TEXAS. AND I THINK IT GOES TO YOUR POINT. AND ERIC'S POINT AS WELL, IS THAT OUR INDIVIDUAL TOLERANCE FOR PAYING OUT OF OUR POCKET.

IS, IS A TOUGH NUT TO CRACK IN TERMS OF WHAT WE WANT TO PRESENT TO THE VOTERS, TO SAY, THIS IS WHAT OUR CITY NEEDS. THIS IS GOING TO COST YOU MORE NO MATTER WHAT WE DO. SO IS IT 12, IS IT 15? IS IT 20? IS IT 23? IS IT 25? AND I THINK THAT'S THANK YOU FOR PUTTING THIS ON US. NO, I KNOW THIS IS PROBABLY THE MOST SERIOUS THING THAT WE AS CITIZENS HAVE HAVE TO APPROACH IN MANY, MANY YEARS BECAUSE OF WHAT'S GOING ON IN OUR CITY. AND I THINK IT'S ONLY RIGHT THAT I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU. MAY OR MAY NOT ACCEPT THIS, BUT I THINK THE LORD HAS PUT THE RIGHT PEOPLE IN THE RIGHT PLACE FOR THIS CONSIDERATION. LOOK AT THIS STUFF AND THEY'LL LISTEN TO WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. PATRICK, AND GO LIKE, HE'S RIGHT. I'D LOVE TO PLAY WITH 23 TO 25. I LOOKED AT, YOU KNOW, THIS LITTLE LIST RIGHT HERE. I CUT OUT ALL THE AMENITIES. I CHOPPED OUT THE REC CENTER, THE DOG PARK, THE PRESERVE, THE LIBRARY. I TOOK OUT A MILLION AND A HALF FOR THE FIRE STATION AT LOW END. IT BROUGHT US DOWN TO 21, BUT THAT'S STILL ANOTHER $8 MILLION OR SO OVER THAT 15 OR SO THAT WE DID. OUR CITIZENS CAN TOLERATE. AND I THINK WHAT WE HAVE TO CONSIDER THE TOUGHEST THING IS, IS THE PSYCHOLOGICAL IMPACT OF TOLERANCE IN TERMS OF WHAT'S IT GOING TO DO TO THEIR BACK POCKET AND WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO. SO MAYBE TRUTHFULLY, IT BOILS DOWN TO MAYBE THREE, I WOULD I LOOK AT THE POLICE, I'M LOOKING AT SERVICE CENTER AND I REALLY WOULD LIKE TO PLAY WITH IT. I REALLY LIKE TO BRING IT INTO THIS BECAUSE MICHAEL, I MEAN CYBER, CYBER FRAUD AND CYBER SECURITY ARE SO IMPORTANT. AND I THINK THE HIGH END WAS FIVE. THE LOW END WAS ONE. I'D PROBABLY GO WITH THE HIGH END FIVE AND LOOK AT EXCUSE ME, LOOK AT THOSE THREE. AND IT WOULD IT WOULD HURT TO TAKE THESE AMENITIES AND SAY YOU CAN'T DO IT. BUT THE THING IS YOU KNOW, CAN WE FUND IT SOME OTHER WAY SOME OTHER TIME. YEAH. AND JUST TO PIGGYBACK ON WHAT YOU SAID, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE COMPLAIN ABOUT THEIR PROPERTY TAXES AND RIGHTFULLY SO. I'M NOT BEING JUDGMENTAL AT ALL. BUT YOU KNOW WHOSE FAULT IT REALLY IS? TEXAS INSTRUMENTS, I MEAN, THIS AREA IS ONE OF THE FEW PLACES IN THE COUNTRY WHERE YOU CAN GET WORK.

YOU CAN'T BLAME PEOPLE. THEY WANT TO WORK. SO THEY COME HERE FOR WORK, AND THEN THEY NEED SOMEWHERE TO STAY. AND THUS AND SO AND THUS AND SO, AND YOU GOT TO PUT THEM SOMEWHERE. SO IT'S JUST SUPPLY AND DEMAND. THAT'S WHAT'S CAUSING THE PROBLEM. YOU KNOW. LOOK AT THE LOOK AT THE I DON'T READ THE DALLAS MORNING NEWS. THERE ARE 200 CORPORATIONS BASED IN THE DALLAS FORT WORTH METROPLEX THAT ARE ON THE NEW YORK STOCK EXCHANGE. WOW, 200 CORPORATE HEADQUARTERS IN DFW.

THAT'S ENORMOUS. AND THEY'RE STILL CALLING. THEY'RE STILL COMING. AND LIKE, PUT $60 BILLION INTO YOUR HEAD. AND THAT'S WHAT TI IS GOING TO SPEND IN SHERMAN. BUT THEY'RE NOT COMING DOWN HERE. THEY'RE GOING TO PROSPER. THEY'RE GOING TO AUBREY. THEY'RE GOING TO PRINCETON. I KNOW, BUT YOU SEE THE ECONOMIC ENGINE THEY WENT WITH DCAD LOOKS AT ALL THIS STUFF. WE'RE THE VICTIMS. I MEAN, YEAH, I THINK WE'RE GOING TO CATCH THE 67 EXPANSION WITH THE ZOO PUSHING SOUTH WHEN DALLAS EVER GETS ITS ACT TOGETHER, REVITALIZE DOWNTOWN, THEN PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BE DRAWN BACK. BECAUSE FOR ME, I WORK DOWNTOWN AND SO IT'S TEN MINUTE DRIVE. I DON'T WANT TO LIVE IN FRISCO BECAUSE IF I GOT TO GO TO COURT, IT'S GOING TO TAKE ME AN HOUR TO GET THERE. SO I MEAN, I DO I MEAN, IT'S BEEN A GOOD INVESTMENT FOR ME TO MOVE

[01:20:01]

WHAT'S YOUR SENSE AS A CITY MANAGER APPROACHING THE CITY COUNCIL? OF US GIVING A RANGE.

AND DON'T WE HAVE TO LOCK DOWN THESE PROJECTS TO. I MEAN, WE KEEP TALKING HIGH AND LOW IN TERMS OF WHAT THE PROJECTED IS TODAY VERSUS THREE, FOUR YEARS FROM NOW. WHAT NUMBER DO DO WE AS A COMMITTEE COME UP WITH FOR THESE ENTITIES, JUST PRESENT THE COUNCIL? I THINK YOU COULD ABSOLUTELY PRESENT A RANGE, IF THAT'S WHAT YOU PREFER TO DO. I THINK MY GUESS IS THAT COUNCIL REALLY WANTED AN INDEPENDENT LOOK, RIGHT, THAT THEY REALLY APPRECIATED YOU GUYS TAKING THE TIME TO VISIT THE BUILDINGS TO UNDERSTAND WHAT HAS HAPPENED WITH THE 2018 BOND PROJECT, TO FACTOR ALL THAT IN AND MAKE A RECOMMENDATION THAT WE SEE REAL NEEDS HERE, WHATEVER HERE IS, AND MAYBE IT'S WE WOULD LOVE TO SEE ALL OF THESE THINGS, BUT THIS IS THE IMMEDIATE PRIORITY.

AND MAYBE THIS IS A SECOND PHASE. PRIORITY OR THIRD PHASE. I THINK YOU COULD ABSOLUTELY DO THAT. IS IT MORE PRACTICAL TO PRESENT WORST CASE? IF IT COMES OUT LESS? YOU KNOW, IF IT COMES OUT LESS, GREAT. IF IT DOESN'T, HERE'S THE WORST CASE. IT'S, YOU KNOW, THE HIGH NUMBER. PEOPLE SPEND WHAT THEY HAVE. THEY WILL NEVER COME OUT LESS. I REALLY DON'T THINK IT WOULD. THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING. SO THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING. WE GIVE IT THE HIGHEST POSSIBLE NUMBER IN TERMS OF WHAT COUNCIL UNDERSTANDS, WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING TO DO, AND LET THEM TAKE IT TO THE VOTERS THAT WAY. AND AT THE END OF THE DAY, IT'S REALLY A BUDGET. NO. YEAH. YEAH. AND SO WE LOVE TO BE ABLE TO TELL THE COUNCIL, THIS IS, THIS IS THIS IS THE NUMBER RIGHT HERE. AND, AND WE GUARANTEE YOU THAT THIS NUMBER WILL TAKE CARE OF IT. YOU KNOW, IT DOESN'T WORK LIKE THAT. SO IS BETTER AS A WHOLE. FINANCE DIRECTORS IS BETTER TO ESTIMATE HIGH. SO THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING.

WE ARE GIVEN WORST CASE. YES. LET THEM SEE. WORST CASE IF IT COMES OUT LESS THAN THAT, GREAT.

BUT WORST CASE THIS IS WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT AS A CITY. RIGHT. AND THAT'S THE TOLERANCE FACTOR THAT WE HAVE TO PRESENT IN THE MARKETING TO THE CITIZENS. WELL, THE OTHER THING JUST ABOUT THAT, AND THAT GOES ALONG WITH WHAT MICHAEL WAS SAYING TOO. RIGHT. SO BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY, AND IT'S EXACTLY WHAT I WAS SAYING TOO, IF WE SAY, OKAY, WE HAVE $12 MILLION, FOR INSTANCE, TO BUILD A POLICE BUILDING. WHILE WE ORIGINALLY WERE TALKING ABOUT A 20,000 SQUARE FOOT BUILDING, WHEN IT GETS TO THAT POINT, WE MAY ONLY BE ABLE TO AFFORD TO BUILD A 15,000 SQUARE BUILDING, RIGHT? BUT THAT'S THE ADJUSTMENT THAT WILL HAPPEN ON THAT END. BECAUSE

[01:25:05]

AND THIS IS HOW MUCH MONEY WE'VE GOT. DON'T GO OVER IT. DESIGN, BUILD, DESIGN BUILD. SO WE COULD ACTUALLY DO THAT. YES. FOR POLICE AND SAY, YOU KNOW, WE'VE GOT $12 MILLION. YES. AND YOU WOULD DESIGN AND BUILD SOMETHING FOR $12 MILLION, AND THEN THE ARCHITECT IS GOING TO COME OUT AND SAY, WELL, YOU KNOW, WE'RE GOING TO CUT THIS DOWN TO THIS MANY SQUARE FEET, BUT THIS IS IF THIS IS YOUR CAP AND WE CAN'T GO OVER IT LIKE NO CHANGE ORDERS. THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS THAT IS CORRECT. NO CHANGE ORDERS. THIS IS HOW MUCH YOU GOT BUILD TO THAT DOLLAR AMOUNT. THAT KIND OF FIXES SOME OF WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT. IT DOES THINK OF IT AS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT THAN A REAL

[01:30:02]

AND SO SAME FOR ALL THE BUILDERS. THEY'RE GOING TO RESEARCH ALL THAT. SO THEY'RE GOING TO KNOW WE'RE GOING TO HAVE $12 MILLION. AND THEN IT'S A MATTER OF WELL THIS BUILDER SAYS, WELL I CAN GIVE YOU A 15,000 SQUARE FOOT BUILDING FOR THIS, AND I CAN DO THE AMENITIES, AND I CAN DO ALL THE OTHER THINGS FOR THIS NUMBER. WELL, I CAN DO AN 18,000 SQUARE FOOT BUILDING. WELL, I CAN DO A 22. THAT'S WHERE THE BEST VALUE COMES IN. SO WHAT IS YOUR INTENTION FOR NEW CONSTRUCTION? TO USE A DESIGN BUILD? ABSOLUTELY. OKAY. SO THAT THAT HELPS. SO AT THIS POINT DO YOU HAVE THE TAKEAWAYS YOU NEED TO GET US TO THE NEXT STEP. SO I BELIEVE WHAT I HEARD TONIGHT PLEASE CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG. I HEARD A LOT OF SUPPORT FOR POLICE AND FIRE OR I'M SORRY, POLICE AND SERVICE CENTER POLICE AND PUBLIC WORKS. I'M SORRY. I DIDN'T MEAN THAT. I HEARD SOME DIFFERENT DISCUSSION BETWEEN 20 MILLION AND 25 MILLION. SO I WOULD LIKE SOME FURTHER DIRECTION ON THAT. I'M CHANGING. GOING MORE TOWARD THIS IS WHAT I THINK WE SHOULD HAVE IN TERMS OF THE PROJECT, WHATEVER THAT DOLLAR COMES OUT TO. I THINK WHAT IT'S COMING OUT TO IS CLOSER TO LIKE THE 15TH TO 17TH. NO NO, NO, NO, 12. WHAT ARE WE LOOKING AT? 12, 1020, 20, 22 I THINK IS WHAT IT'S COMING OUT TO, WHICH IS OFF OF YOUR 15.

RIGHT. AND I KNOW THAT I MEAN, THAT WAS I'M VERY FRUGAL. AND SO, YOU KNOW, I'M LOOKING AT MONEY SITTING IN OTHER POCKETS THAT AREN'T UP THERE ANYMORE. AND I'M THINKING, WHY AREN'T WE USING THAT? YOU KNOW, WE'RE STILL NOT CONSIDERING THAT WHEN WE'RE LOOKING AT OUR OUR FINAL NUMBER HERE. AND I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY, TO BE QUITE HONEST, I'M WITH HER ON THAT BECAUSE I MY THING IS THE FIRE STATION NUMBER TWO STOP WITH THE DIESEL. I MEAN, THAT'S FRANKLY PROBABLY MY MOST IMPORTANT THING, BUT MY THINKING IS HERS IS THAT I MAY NOT HER THINKING, BUT THE IDEA IS THAT THAT 500 TO 1 MILLION, WE SHOULD BE ABLE TO PULL OUT OF ANOTHER BUCKET AND NOT. SO MY QUESTION TO YOU IS THAT IS THAT ACTUALLY FEASIBLE THAT WE CAN BECAUSE THEY DON'T NEED TO BE BREATHING IN DIESEL FUMES. THAT'S THAT'S NOT OKAY BY ME. SO IF THAT CAN'T BE DONE IN A GENERAL FUND OR ONE OF THESE OTHER BUCKETS, THEN I NEED TO RECONSIDER. IF IT NEEDS TO BE A HIGHER PRIORITY ON MY LIST. I'M GLAD YOU GUYS BROUGHT THIS UP, BECAUSE AND EVEN TO LINDA'S POINT ABOUT LIKE PHASE ONE OF THE DOG PARK, MAYBE IT DOESN'T GET YOU ALL OF THAT STUFF, BUT PERHAPS IT'S A RECOMMENDATION TO COUNCIL TO USE OTHER SOURCES, SUCH AS UNASSIGNED FUND BALANCE TO FIX THE PROBLEM THAT'S BEEN IDENTIFIED WITH THE FIRE STATION. MAYBE CONSIDER PHASE ONE IF THAT'S WHAT YOU WANT TO DO WITH THE DOG PARK. MAYBE THERE'S SOME OTHER SPECIFIC NUMBERS THAT WE CAN WORK ON ON THE IT RELATED STUFF. UTILIZE HOT FUNDS FOR THE IMPROVEMENTS NEEDED AT THE FIELD HOUSE. THOSE COULD ALL BE SEPARATE FROM THE SPECIFIC DOLLAR AMOUNT RELATED TO THE BOND. IF THAT MAKES SENSE. WELL. TO ERICA'S POINT, WE DID TALK ABOUT FURNISHING THE POLICE STATION WITH FUND BALANCE. SO MAYBE. MAYBE WITH THE FIRE STATION IMPROVEMENTS, WHICH SOUNDS LIKE A LIFE SAFETY ISSUE SHOULD BE GIVEN SOME PRIORITY. MAYBE WE CAN, I DON'T KNOW, GO HALF ON HALF FUND BALANCE. JUST SEE IF YOU CAN WORK IT OUT TO. OKAY. LET ME CHIEF COULD WE USE. SO AGAIN THERE'S TWO. WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT ALL THESE DIFFERENT LEVERS RIGHT. AGAIN TO THE CONVERSATION WE WERE JUST HAVING ABOUT DESIGN BUILD, IT'S ENTIRELY POSSIBLE THAT THE BUILDER THAT ENDS UP GETTING THIS MAY INCLUDE SOME OF THE BUILD OUT. RIGHT. WE WON'T KNOW THAT UNTIL WE GET THAT. BUT IN THE CASE WHERE IT COMES UP SHORT AND WE NEED ADDITIONAL MONEY, ARE YOU CONFIDENT THAT WE COULD USE ASSET FORFEITURE FOR SOME OF THAT OR. NO, NO. IT'S PERMISSIBLE. IT'S NOT ALLOWABLE OKAY. FOR NEW CONSTRUCTION. HOW ABOUT FOR THE ACTUAL LIKE INTERIOR IMPROVEMENTS RELATIVE TO ANY TECHNOLOGY THINGS ANY LIKE ANY OF THAT KIND OF STUFF? I DON'T BELIEVE SO. BUT I CAN GET CONFIRMATION THROUGH MARS AND SEE WHAT THEY. OKAY, OKAY.

[01:35:02]

NO, NO, NO, THAT'S NOT HOW I WANT TO END MY CAREER. YEAH, RIGHT. YEAH, YEAH. WHITE COLLAR ONE. YEAH YEAH YEAH. DETENTION. YEAH. YEAH. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. SO WE'LL HAVE TO FOLLOW UP ON THAT.

BUT YES. OR UNASSIGNED FUND BALANCE OR WHATEVER THE CASE. WE CAN LOOK AT THOSE THINGS. THE SERVICE CENTER HAS FROM. IT HAS A LOT OF FLEXIBILITY WITH THE UTILITY FUND. SO I'M NOT AT ALL WORRIED ABOUT THAT. SO YEAH OKAY OKAY. OKAY. SO I GUESS MY ONLY OTHER QUESTION. SO WE'RE TALKING GIVE OR TAKE I THINK TO GO BACK TO QUESTION NUMBER ONE, I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE EVERYBODY'S IN AGREEMENT WITH A BOND. RIGHT OKAY. AND WE'RE TALKING SOMEWHERE IN THE GENERAL BALLPARK OF 20 MILLION. BUT WE'RE GOING TO TRY TO FOCUS IT ON SPECIFICALLY THE POLICE, THE SERVICE CENTER, AND THEN TAKING CARE OF SOME OF THESE OTHER THINGS WITH THE OTHER MONIES. I GUESS MY ONLY OTHER QUESTION IS, IS YOUR RECOMMENDATION? FOR SURE? FIRE STATION TWO I GET THAT. I KNOW THERE'S BEEN A LITTLE BIT OF CONVERSATION ABOUT THAT DOG PARK. IS THAT A YES OR NO? IS THAT A THUMBS UP OR A THUMBS DOWN? I MEAN, I TAKE YOUR POINT. WELL, THOUGH. I MEAN, THERE'S KIND OF A VALUE TO HAVING SOMETHING THAT'S NOT JUST EMERGENCY SERVICES, BUT I MEAN, I DON'T I DON'T HAVE A SOLUTION FOR IT, THOUGH. IF ALL WE EVER DO IS PUT OUT FIRES BY TAKING CARE OF, WE ABSOLUTELY NEED TO TAKE CARE OF THE POLICE STATION AND THE SERVICE CENTER. BUT THOSE ARE PUTTING OUT FIRES. WE'RE NOT GOING TO PROGRESS AS A CITY IF ALL WE EVER DO IS PUT OUT FIRES. WE ALSO NEED TO CONSIDER THINGS LIKE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT BRINGING REVENUE INTO THE CITY. OKAY, I'M SORRY PEOPLE AREN'T VISITING DUNCANVILLE TO SEE THE POLICE STATION. WE NEED TO TAKE CARE OF OUR POLICE STATION. BUT THEY'RE VISITING THE DUNCAN FOR EVERYTHING UNDERNEATH THAT AND OUR RESTAURANTS AND THINGS LIKE THAT. SO WE ARE OPENING UP A LOT MORE POTENTIAL FOR REVENUE WHEN WE MAKE IMPROVEMENTS TO THESE THINGS OR HAVE THE ONLY DOG PARK IN THE TRI CITY OR THINGS LIKE THAT. SO I JUST AND THERE ARE A LOT OF THEM ARE ON THE LOWER END, AT LEAST FOR THE LOW ESTIMATE. AND SO IT FEELS LIKE WE COULD AT LEAST DO SOME AMOUNT ALLOCATED TO THAT COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT, THE AMENITIES, THE THINGS THAT ARE ACTUALLY BRINGING PEOPLE INTO THE CITY. YEAH, THE DOG PARK COULD BE LOOKED AT AS A VALUE PROPOSITION IN TERMS OF A TAXPAYER. WHERE IS MY TAX MONEY GOING? YEAH, I'M HAPPY TO HAVE MY TAX MONEY GO FOR FIRE AND SAFETY. BUT WE'VE ALWAYS TALKED ABOUT IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN AND EVERYWHERE ELSE, WE WANT A CITY THAT IS LIVABLE. WE WANT TO LIVE HERE, WE WANT TO WORK HERE, WE WANT TO PLAY HERE. AND THAT AMENITY OF ANY KIND OF A DOG PARK COULD ATTRACT PEOPLE TO US.

AND WHAT ELSE COULD THEY DO? OR THEY MAY BE BUYING HOUSES, THEY MAY BE DOING MORE, BUT IT'S THAT LIVE HERE, WORK HERE AND PLAY HERE. WE'RE MORE ABOUT THE DOG PARK WAS A PROPOSED. YEAH. IS TO BE A HAPPY PLACE. YEAH I WANT, I WANT TO I WANT A HAPPY PLACE TO GO. AND I'M WILLING TO PAY FOR IT WITH MY TAX MONEY AND MAYBE JUST A PHASE ONE, SOME PIECE OF IT COULD DO SOME OF THAT. I'M KIND OF CHANGING MY MIND ABOUT THE DOG PARK. AT FIRST I WAS LIKE, NO, BUT HEARING THE VOICES OF EVERYONE HERE, THIS DOES ADD VALUE. AND YOU WANT TO BE, YOU KNOW, PROUD OF YOUR CITY. I MEAN, WE'RE PROUD OF OUR CITY, BUT WE WANT TO BRAG, YOU KNOW, HEY, WE GOT A DOG PARK. WE HAVE THIS AND THAT. SO, YEAH, I SEE A PLACE FOR IT. IT'S A VALUE PROPOSITION. YEAH. AND MAYBE IT DOESN'T HAVE TO COST THAT MUCH. I MEAN, OUT OF THOSE OTHER FUNDS, LIKE, WE, YOU KNOW, WE'VE GOT THESE SURPLUSES AND, YOU KNOW, WE'RE LOOKING AT WHAT, 3 MILLION, RIGHT? I MEAN, CAN WE GET ONE AND A HALF, TWO OUT OF THAT OR SOMETHING. AND THEN IT'S A LITTLE LESS A LITTLE A LITTLE EASIER TO SWALLOW PUTTING $1 MILLION BOND ON A DOG PARK. WELL, I KNOW MY CONVERSATION.

I'LL SHARE WITH YOU THAT I'VE ALWAYS HAD WITH COUNCIL SINCE WE COMPLETED THE DOG PARK MASTER PLAN. IS THAT SOME ELEMENT OF THAT WOULD INCLUDE COMMUNITY FUNDRAISING, RIGHT? THAT THERE WOULD BE A GROUP THAT THAT FUND RAISES PARTS OF THAT. SO TO YOUR POINT, MAYBE THERE IS PART OF IT AND IT ABSOLUTELY DOES NOT NECESSARILY HAVE TO BE PART OF THE BOND, BUT IT COULD STILL BE PART OF YOUR REPORT. EXACTLY WHAT YOU GUYS ARE SAYING, THAT WE SEE VALUE IN THE BENEFIT OF THE COMMUNITY OF IT. AND WE WOULD LIKE TO SUGGEST THAT YOU USE FUND BALANCE TO KICK IT OFF OR GET IT STARTED TYPE THING. RIGHT. WE COULD JUST A BRAINSTORMING. WE COULD SET ASIDE A CERTAIN AMOUNT AND SAY THE CITY HAS THESE FUNDS TO MATCH ANY FUNDS THAT THE

[01:40:03]

THAT PARK WOULD BE A GOOD WIN. I GET WHAT YOU'RE ASKING. IF YOU DIDN'T HAVE TRANSPORTATION AND YOU WERE HERE, NOT DALLAS. YEAH. WHAT IS IT YOU CAN'T GET ANYWHERE ELSE? WHAT IS THE ADDED VALUE DOWN HERE, EXACTLY? AND A LOT OF THESE YOUNGER KIDS, THEY DON'T REALLY DRIVE. RIGHT. SO WHATEVER CITY THEY'RE IN, THEY NEED TO BE ABLE TO GET TO WALK IT, BUS IT, YOU KNOW, BIKE WHATEVER. SO LIKE IT. THAT'S WHY OUR EDC IS SO IMPORTANT BECAUSE THERE'S NOWHERE TO BUY CLOTHES HERE, RIGHT? YOU KNOW, YOU NEED THOSE KINDS OF THINGS TO. SO CHAIRMAN, IN TERMS OF NEXT STEPS, I WILL GO THROUGH, IF ANYBODY ELSE HAS ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR THINGS THAT YOU FOR THE REPORT THAT YOU WANT TO INCLUDE THAT WE DIDN'T TALK ABOUT, I GUESS JUST EMAIL ME, BUT I'LL GO THROUGH AND TWEAK IT BASED ON TONIGHT'S CONVERSATION. I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S GOING TO BE BY THE END OF THIS WEEK, BUT SOME DEFINITELY BY THE END OF THE WEEK. NEXT WEEK, I WILL GET THAT OUT TO YOU SO THAT YOU HAVE THAT UPDATED DRAFT TO LOOK AT. AND I GUESS MY ONLY OTHER QUESTION IS, TENTATIVELY, WE WERE TALKING ABOUT POSSIBLE PRESENTATION TO CITY COUNCIL ON THE 15TH. SO MY QUESTION WOULD BE IF YOU WANT TO HAVE ONE MORE MEETING TO REVIEW THAT ONE MORE TIME TO GO OVER THAT OR OKAY, OKAY, OKAY. BY THE WAY, THIS IS. IT REALLY I MEAN, THIS IS AN INCREDIBLE PIECE OF WORK. HOW MUCH OF IT REMAINS AFTER TONIGHT IS IRRELEVANT. THIS IS A FANTASTIC RESOURCE. THANK YOU. WELL, I WANTED TO I WANTED REGARDLESS OF WHAT HAPPENS.

RIGHT. AND THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS I'VE ALWAYS TRIED TO DO WITH ANY MUNICIPALITY I'VE WORKED WITH THAT YOU DOCUMENT WHAT'S REALLY GOING ON SO THAT AT LEAST YOU HAVE A DOCUMENT THAT YOU CAN PICK UP AND UNDERSTAND. HERE'S WHAT'S HAPPENED, HERE'S WHAT DIDN'T HAPPEN. RIGHT. AND THEN YOU HAVE A BLUEPRINT FOR GOING FORWARD. SO IF NOTHING ELSE, JUST THE FACT THAT IT EXISTS IS VALUABLE FOR HISTORY. THE ARCHIVE IS THERE. JUST FOR GRINS. I DID A MUSIC I. I ASKED FOR THE WHAT IS THE CURRENT MEDIAN PRICE FOR A HOUSE IN THE CITY OF DUNCANVILLE, AND AS OF MAY OF 2025, IT'S ABOUT $315,000. WOW. THAT'S CRAZY. WHICH IS ABOVE

[01:45:06]

WELL, AND I HAVE NO WORDS I KNOW AND I'M LOOKING AT SOME. YEAH. SO IT RANGES FROM 315,000 UP TO 379,000 FOR THE MEDIAN IN THE CITY OF KNOXVILLE. RIGHT. AS OF MAY I EVEN WITH MY HOUSE, LIKE MICHAEL WAS SAYING, I GOT MY DCAD AND I WANTED TO CONTEST IT. AND SO I STARTED DOING MY OWN RESEARCH AND IT BECAME CHALLENGING. I THINK IT WORKED OUT TO OVER THE LAST 24 MONTHS, THE AVERAGE HOME IN DUNCANVILLE HAS SOLD FOR ABOUT $265 A SQUARE FOOT. I THINK THAT'S WHAT THE NUMBER WORKED OUT TO. SO IT'S A IT'S A BIG NUMBER. AND SO I CHALLENGED MINE AND DCAD CAME BACK AND SAID, YEAH, WE'LL KNOCK 15,000 OFF THAT NICE DAY. SO, SO THAT'S SIX. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

I'LL GO BUY A SNICKERS. OKAY. SO WE HAVE ONE MORE MEETING ON JULY 7TH, AND THEN YOU MEET WITH COUNCIL. WE JUST ADDED ANOTHER DATE TO IT, BUT IT WAS ALWAYS ON THE CALENDAR. SEVENTH RIGHT.

YEAH OKAY OKAY. WHAT ARE THE MECHANICS OF THIS PRESENTATION? I MEAN, ARE WE ALL SHOWING UP TO A MEETING AND THEN WATCHING CHAIRMAN HARVEY. NO NO NO NO NO NO NO. YOU YOU'RE AN ATTORNEY.

YOU'RE THE ONE I WAS ENRAPTURED. YOU'RE TELLING ME THIS PERSONAL STORY ABOUT RETIREMENT. I WAS LIKE, WHERE'S HE GOING WITH THIS? I'VE BEEN ASKING FOR. OKAY, SO WE HAVE A MEETING ON THE SEVENTH, AND THEN WHETHER WE ADD. ANYTHING, I ALSO HAVE ONE ON 17 ON THE. I THINK THAT MIGHT BE A PRESENTED. SO THAT SHOULD BE THE LAST. SHOULD BE THE LAST ONE. THE SEVENTH WOULD BE YOUR LAST MEETING BECAUSE IT WILL RESIDE ON THE 15TH. AND THEN THAT'LL WRAP IT UP. SO EVERYBODY IS WELCOME TO ATTEND. WE'RE HAVING A DISCUSSION ON THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN ON JULY 22ND.

IF YOU DON'T HAVE ANYTHING TO DO, WE WOULD WELCOME YOU TO THE FIELDHOUSE. BUT SO I LOST THE CONVERSATION. WE HAVE WE HAVE JULY 7TH FOR SURE. WE'LL JUST ADD. JUST THE CITY COUNCIL. TOOK OFF. WE TOOK OFF 17 OH. ONE MORE. YEAH. CITY COUNCIL 15. SO WE SHOULD WRAP EVERYTHING UP ON THE SEVENTH. YES. SO IF WE COULD GO BACK TO THAT. SO, SO ON THE 15TH, WE WON'T HAVE ENOUGH TIME TO DO THE PRESENTATION HERE IN THE BRIEFING ROOM. SO IT WOULD ACTUALLY BE OUT IN THE MAIN AREA. AND WE'LL PUT IT FIRST. THAT'S ALSO THE SAME NIGHT AS THE PUBLIC HEARING FOR LIFE SCHOOL. SO WE'LL PUT THE BOND COMMITTEE FIRST SO YOU DON'T HAVE TO SIT THROUGH. OH THANKS.

WE'RE GOING TO BE CROWDING I DON'T KNOW I MIGHT WANT TO STAY RIGHT I KNOW THAT'S I KNOW THAT'S. WHAT I MIGHT BE OUT OF TOWN. I MIGHT WATCH THAT. I IT'S REALLY UP TO YOU GUYS HOW YOU WANT TO PRESENT. I'M SURE YOU KNOW COUNCIL WOULD YOU KNOW, I'LL TRY TO DOCUMENT EVERYTHING AND WE'LL GO BACK AND WE'LL LOOK AT THAT REPORT. BUT WE'LL NEED TO COME UP WITH A POWERPOINT PRESENTATION, SOME OF THE KEY POINTS HIGHLIGHTS. AND THEN I'D BE HAPPY. I'D BE HAPPY TO DO IT AGAIN. JUST PULL PULL THE BRAIN TRUST TOGETHER AND GIVE ME SOME WORDS. RIGHT. AND IT'S OKAY WITH YOU IF THEY WANT TO COME TO THE PODIUM AT THE SAME TIME, I'M SURE COUNCIL WOULD APPRECIATE THAT. SO I DON'T KNOW. IT MAY IT MAY BE AN AWFUL LONG TIME FOR SOME OF US TO STAND UP. SO. SO, BUT I KNOW THAT THEY'RE VERY APPRECIATIVE OF EVERYTHING YOU GUYS HAVE BEEN DOING. AND ALL THE TIME THAT YOU'VE PUT INTO THAT SERIOUSLY. SO THEY'RE DEFINITELY GOING TO WANT TO THANK YOU. SO, SO THE 15 I'M SORRY FOR INTERRUPTING. SO I'M TRYING TO GET THE CALENDAR STRAIGHT HERE. SO THE 15TH OF JULY IS WHEN THE REPORT IS PRESENTED. YES OKAY. I DO APPRECIATE ALL THE WORK THAT YOU PUT INTO YOUR TOURS AND HELPING US TO SEE BECAUSE I, I CAME HERE THINKING I'M NOT VOTING FOR A BOND, BUT THE NEED IS OBVIOUS AND I APPRECIATE THAT. WELL, AND THAT WAS PART OF IT. SO THAT YOU GUYS COULD REALLY SEE WHAT WE SAW SO THAT YOU COULD THEN MAKE AN UNBIASED, INDEPENDENT RECOMMENDATION TO COUNCIL. SO, SO. ABSOLUTELY. THANK YOU.

[01:50:11]

THE. REFLECTION ON THAT ONE. IT WAS NO NO NO I'M TRYING TO PUT IT ON MY CALENDAR BEFORE I FORGET. MAN I DO LOOK GOOD IN THIS BLUE, DON'T I? ANYWAY, WITH THAT BEING SAID, THIS MEETING IS

* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.